White supremacists protecting Churchill statue get 'that work' in UK

[Duty]

Do you have any evidence that Tommy Robinson is a white supremacist? I'm English and judge him to be a nasty piece of work, yes, but his beef is with immigrants, and Islam in particular, not genetic "race."

I'm not English but from what I hear is his problem with muslims stated after his sister married one. According to wikipedia he is or has been a white nationalist.

So that would be a "no" then, just the...er..."similar" term "white nationalist" ...POSSIBLY current, but nothing definitive. Hardly a smoking gun dude. 

Also, how does Tommy Fuckwit Robinson calling on his social media followers to protect WCs statue, with no mention of anything remotely racist, and people getting beaten up for trying to protect that statue = they're white supremacists/nationalists, or even followers of Tommy Robinson at all?

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Our white supremacists also choose to communicate their position in those terms.  In any case, bigots aren't actually obsessed with any genetic race, they're obsessed with a fiction of race.  If we wanted to see how much of a blindside the uk has when it comes to white supremacy, check the wiki on white supremacy in the UK.  It lists neo-nazis..and that's it.  

Yeah, there's a reason for that TGN - we don't do white supremacy organisations! As I said.

This isn't just an issue with the uk, but an example of looking for the last adversary or planning to fight the last war instead of the one in front of us today.  There are white supremacists in britain, there are political parties that cater to british white supremacy.  They're as out as out can be.  They employ the same rhetoric and they use the same propaganda, to the same effect.  They were very recently a canary in the coal mine when it came to our own white supremacist leanings in the states.

My underlined - you HAVE to be joking   as for the rest of the bold - Evidence?

[The Grand Nudger]

You do, you just call them white nationalists. So do we. So do they. Nobody wants to be called a white supremacist, not even white supremacists. It's a damaging label that needed a re-brand, and got one.

Like I said, if you're looking for nazis, then you could be forgiven for thinking that the white supremacy problem has been solved. Not just there, but here and anywhere else. Nazis are thin on the ground. White supremacists, by any name, otoh, enjoy significant political power and more than just a little bit of public support.

[Athene]

@Huggy Bear

Yeah, he got that work, I guess. Seems like all this focus on statues is a clear diversion, though.
IDK.

It's great to know that black folks still have the heart and will for rebellion, but there's WAY, WAY too many damn white people involved in this shit---the worst, most unstable, deranged, untrustworthy type of white folks at that.
And they're everywhere. On the ground, behind the scenes, pulling strings, moving money, gushing over BLM online like loons; just exploiting and co-opting the living fuck out of black oppression to their own devious little ends, as usual. Only on steroids this time.
It's disgusting.

When rioters begin giving these fuckshit so-called "allies" the business, then I'll know the revolution's really started.

I rock with  a number of pro-black establishments who are all for the get down; including the house of Vodou---and you know they're ready to get it on and poppin' in this motherfucker.
But no one's fixing to be used as props by the goddamn Dems to secure an election or degenerate white folks looking to fulfill their Socialist wet dreams. 
Damn that.

That's BLM's job...heh heh

[Duty]

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You do, you just call them white nationalists.  So do we.  So do they.  Nobody wants to be called a white supremacist, not even white supremacists.  It's a damaging label that needed a re-brand, and got one.

Like I said, if you're looking for nazis, then you could be forgiven for thinking that the white supremacy problem has been solved.  Not just there, but here and anywhere else.  Nazis are thin on the ground.  White supremacists, by any name, otoh, enjoy significant political power and more than just a little bit of public support.

You are claiming there is no difference between white supremacy and white nationalism. That is:

a) Demonstrably incorrect as the terms have profoundly different strict meanings.
b) Extremely unhelpful given the hyperbole laden hysteria currently gripping the West re racism.

The rest of your post falls foul of b) too and is also devoid of evidence. "White supremacists are running large parts of this country and have lots of support from genpop!!" - which country's that TGN - the land that time forgot? Is Scarlett O'Hara the president?

[The Grand Nudger]

Sounds like it wouldn't end well.

[Nay_Sayer]

If the statue gets successfully kept down then that's what God wants.

0/10

[The Grand Nudger]

Anywho. Editz, I think that my comments offend your sensibilities more than being demonstrably untrue, and that's a good thing. We also prefer to believe that we don't have a white supremacist problem, but..instead, a white nationalist problem.

[Duty]

Anywho. Editz, I think that my comments offend your sensibilities more than being demonstrably untrue, and that's a good thing.  We also prefer to believe that we don't have a white supremacist problem, but..instead, a white nationalist problem.

I don't think we have either, really TBH, in the UK at least. To call, say, the British Nationalist Party a "fringe" political group would be to vastly exaggerate its size. 

I thought it was rather these current troubles are something todo with failings in police training and also racial profiling caused by black people committing (relatively speaking) far more crime? 

Why might black men commit more crime than whites in the USA? Perhaps they refuse to work for the boss (white man, invariably), saying "yessir nosir boss," as it were, due to slavery, for most of their working life (now wouldn't that be understandable?) so most jobs are out of the question. Also America has basically fuck all welfare state so...starving...need money therefore crime....

...and in any case...you know what? I'm gonna go out and commit AS MUCH CRIME AS POSSIBLE BECAUSE FUCK YOU WHITE AMERICA BOSS SLAVERS!!! Also fully understandable...to a degree. 

There's also in recent years been the rise of BLM which promotes distrust and hatred of the police causing perhaps more, shall we say, disobedience leading to fatalities.

Or perhaps, on the other hand, there are systematic invisible oppressive structures pinning down BAME people, leaving crime as the only option for survival, which White America has put in place in order to achieve....what exactly? Do tell, I'm all ears.

The fact this whole furore has revolved around ripping down ANCIENT statues and fighting police surely speaks VOLUMES that society isn't now racist for the overwhelming part (and thank goodness for that!) as there are no CURRENT targets!

And breath.

[The Grand Nudger]

Flirting with the idea of an ethnostate is the attempt to declare that ethnicity superior by legal decree. Even by a definition of white supremacy so restrictive that nearly nothing could be white supremacy, white nationalism still fits the bill. Food for thought.

White nationalism is a type of nationalism or pan-nationalism which espouses the belief that white people are a race[1] and seeks to develop and maintain a white racial and national identity.[2][3][4] Its proponents identify with and are attached to the concept of a white nation, or a "white ethnostate".[5]

Analysts describe white nationalism as overlapping with white supremacism and white separatism.[6][4][7][8][9][10] White nationalism is sometimes described as a euphemism for, or subset of, white supremacism, and the two have been used interchangeably by journalists and analysts.[8][11] White separatism is the pursuit of a "white-only state"; supremacism is the belief that white people are superior to nonwhites and should dominate them,[7][8][9] taking ideas from social Darwinism and Nazism.[12] White nationalists generally avoid the term "supremacy" because it has negative connotations.[13][14]

As for my thoughts on the things you mentioned with respect to the us. It's not actually true that black people are more criminal than white people. That one group commits more crime than the other. The disparity is in policing, not criminality. Similarly, while we can understand the argument that poorer people might be more inclined to theft, judging by the amount of theft at the top......that might just be our intuition steering us in the wrong direction. Jobs being "out of the question" for african americans has more to do with the employers than any refusal to work.

I really don't think that the incredibly strange comment about committing as much crime as possible is something that motivates many people, and wouldn't be understandable to me at all, at any rate. It is the actions of police which have cause more and more mistrust, not BLM.

If you're asking what the oppressive structures built into our system's goal was, the answer is contained in the question. To oppress.

Monument culture as state propaganda is a current thing. They don't just represent past misdeeds, they represent our willingness to gloss those things over and lionize the oppressor in the present. Thankfully, statues are things, and not people. The destruction of literal monuments to racism is preferable to the destruction of people, even racist people - though the latter might be more effective in the end. Nazis being thin on the ground.

[Duty]

Flirting with the idea of an ethnostate is the attempt to declare that ethnicity superior by legal decree.  Even by a definition of white supremacy so restrictive that nearly nothing could be white supremacy, white nationalism still fits the bill.  Food for thought.

White nationalism is a type of nationalism or pan-nationalism which espouses the belief that white people are a race[1] and seeks to develop and maintain a white racial and national identity.[2][3][4] Its proponents identify with and are attached to the concept of a white nation, or a "white ethnostate".[5]

Analysts describe white nationalism as overlapping with white supremacism and white separatism.[6][4][7][8][9][10] White nationalism is sometimes described as a euphemism for, or subset of, white supremacism, and the two have been used interchangeably by journalists and analysts.[8][11] White separatism is the pursuit of a "white-only state"; supremacism is the belief that white people are superior to nonwhites and should dominate them,[7][8][9] taking ideas from social Darwinism and Nazism.[12] White nationalists generally avoid the term "supremacy" because it has negative connotations.[13][14]

As for my thoughts on the things you mentioned with respect to the us.  It's not actually true that black people are more criminal than white people.  That one group commits more crime than the other.  The disparity is in policing, not criminality.  Similarly, while we can understand the argument that poorer people might be more inclined to theft, judging by the amount of theft at the top......that might just be our intuition steering us in the wrong direction.  Jobs being "out of the question" for african americans has more to do with the employers than any refusal to work.  

I really don't think that the incredibly strange comment about committing as much crime as possible is something that motivates many people, and wouldn't be understandable to me at all, at any rate.  It is the actions of police which have cause more and more mistrust, not BLM.

If you're asking what the oppressive structures built into our system's goal was, the answer is contained in the question.  To oppress.  

Monument culture as state propaganda is a current thing.  They don't just represent past misdeeds, they represent our willingness to gloss those things over and lionize the oppressor in the present.  Thankfully, statues are things, and not people.  The destruction of literal monuments to racism is preferable to the destruction of people, even racist people - though the latter might be more effective in the end.  Nazis being thin on the ground.

RE the thought food, yes the two terms seem to somewhat overlap, but the primary meanings are fundamentally different, and what with language determining thought to a large extent, if people identify as white nationalists reather than white supremacists they'll be less prone to trying to "have Sauron style dominion over other "races"" as their identity does not incorporate that element. Yes some WSs doubtless hide in the ranks of WNs but saying that 1 = the other is...well, hyperbolic and blunt. And unhelpful. Tommy Robinson and the EDL are a single issue element - they want Islam out of the UK, NOTHING WHATSOEVER like white supremacy, so OP is still wildly inaccurate hyperbole and needs to change, as does the thread title. 

My bold: If that's true then I will change my stance on this. Please furnish this thread with the evidence to that effect if, indeed, it exists.