Another gun discussion part deux.

[The Grand Nudger]

Buried in all of that horseshit, was the gem that you're convinced gun control dems are buying up all the gunstuff as their cities burn.

[Drich]

Dam you don't get it Drich.

The world doesn't need  to make more guns. If we suddenly stopped making them, we'd still have plenty for centuries. 

well thats completely untrue. the bann on full automatic weapons that says you can not own one before 1985 proves this. a 1928 thompson sub machine gun/military surplus before the ban went for like 200.00 (grandfather had one because he carried one as an mp in wwii) so he bought one at liggett's drug store paid his 200.00 for it.. the same gun will now run between 8k in serviceable but poor condition to 20k for like new not to mention parts are harder and harder to replace. unique to full auto verse semi.

I am not even saying we can stop makers from making new guns. But we damned sure need the makers to take responsibility for what they make, and where their products end up.

great how do you supposed we do that? now how do you make a law breaking criminal do the same?

What we have now is an attitude of "more is better" and " if you question what we sell, or how much we sell, you are evil."

again current demand by most of your former democrats who never owned one, and fence sitters are the reason there is such a demand for guns. when you guys are not threating to take our guns or put more restrictions on them, manufacturing actually stops for all but the most popular models. threating to regulate guns is what drives the market.

This is fucking nonsense if one is going to rightfully argue, "Just keep them out of the wrong hands", which I agree we should keep them out of the wrong hands, then the key is VETTING at time of purchase. And right now, we have crappy vetting.

please describe what you think the vetting process is, and how it can improve.

[The Grand Nudger]

There it is again.

[Drich]

ghost guns like 80% milled receivers? do you have any idea how much work goes into one of those to make it operational? how tight the tolerances have to be in order for them to work reliably? 90% of them fail habitually/jam up or nothing at all happens when you pull the trigger. most of those are sold with the idea with some patience and a drill and dremel you can have a ar receiver with a few well placed holes. in truth you need a 5 axis cnc machine/auto mill to make those work. and if you have that you do not need a 80% receiver.. plus if you use one it has to be registered.
If you have a cnc it will be easier to start from a solid block of material because you will have to take hours setting up and plotting out the 80% receiver in the machine so it is properly oriented/the computer is aligned to know where to cut out what..  where as the machine (if you have the program) can take a block of billet aluminum and cut your own receiver in 1/2 the time. but then are subject to federal regulations and have to file as a manufacturer.. which again defeats the purpose of a 80% lower.  also if you build one, you can't legally transfer it or sell it to any one. the only option is to turn it is to the police or someone like me to be destroyed if you don't use it as a wall hanger.

Ghost guns are a joke. because there maybe only a few hundred people who have the skills and hand tools at home (have to be built at home) can build them out legally. mean hand forge/hume them out with hand tools. remember you can't buy or put them on any specialized mill or other machining equipment. otherwise it is considered to be manufactured which means it is subject to regulation/serial number by a licensed fire arm manufacturer. which again defeats the purpose. this is just a way for 1/2 asses gun builders to make money on a loop hole they found.. if you want to be scared of something.. the 3d printed receiver is a far greater threat as anyone can just print out a ghost gun and all the special cuts and machine work is already done.

if someone wants a box of 80% lowers they don't need me to get them as they are considered aluminum blocks. they can buy from the manufacturer. I would be an unnecessary middle man. 

that said i do plan on buying some lowers and kit them out with tactical triggers and some tricked out uppers. but the will be sold as regular firearms. but have to do more research and find a suppliers to make it all work.

right now the only think im doing is setting up the show room and trying to make contacts.. might be going to 'glock school' to become an authorized dealer. we will see what they say.

I notice that you didn't address the law. 

As far as making/assembling, my dealer makes them (I have not bought one) and says it's easy.: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homemade_f...Production

Your guy can sell you a 80% complete receiver which means 20% still needs to be cut out, because what he is selling you is a semi shaped block of solid billet stock. billet aluminumn stock is not illegal. it's when that block of raw material is all drilled out and finished to accept a lowers parts kits, that it becomes a receiver.

this basically means you have to whittle (carving a stick or wood into a shape or character with a pocket knife.) a precision firearm out of a block of aluminum using a a drill bit who is designed to make straight perfectly round holes 1/2 inch in diameter or smaller, when your first hole is about 4" long 2.5" wide with steps and reliefs cut all the way down with chanel guides and markers along the way and you primary cutting to only drills 1/2 in holes. your secondary tool is a rotary sander. there is a weeks worth of work here doing this by hand, which again is the only legal way it works.    
https://www.polymer80.com/CMS-Images/Pol...ctions.pdf

and if you read i did speak about what the law allows and does not in the manufacturing process and ability to sell or transfer your work. and again the cuts matter down to the .01 of an inch, so if you over drill by .1 you now have a paper weight.

you could know one or two of these things out in a day in a proper shop, but again not legal to build out that way as that would they require a serial number.

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You need a 5 axis CNC to complete a reciever?



That's odd.

I did an AR10 blank last year on my MANUAL vertical mill - with only verniers. No DRO.

The rifle works fine.


....

More BS, eh?

got a youtube video?

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militia is not regular army you know that right? a militia are those guns who show up to antifa rallies and 'guard' store fronts. kyle what's his name that shot 3 dudes is considered militia. I honestly believe most of us who do own long guns have several other people we hang out with that could very well be considered a small squad or even platoon of militia men. On the right I do not see that as an issue. however gun ownership on the left seems to be more self serving. there isn't a prevalent gun culture to speak of and when one is assembled (the not F-ing around boys/the all black open carry guys) can't seem to get together without negligently discharging their guns and shooting one another with them. Honestly the 2nd amendment is the only reason we have not plunged into a civil war yet.

So why did they want a regulated militia?
Because it was supposed to be INSTEAD of a standing army.
So to keep your guns you should really get rid of your army.

again sport the supreme court rule otherwise. your point in moot. the supreme court ruled the militia was not the reason to keep an bear arms the supreme court rule self defense was the ultimate reason for this right. on a macro level ie the militia and micro level personal/home defense.

learn to yield to authority. understand you are not debating me here. i posted a supreme court ruling on the final interpretation of this matter. meaning this is the official position of this country concerning this topic. the supreme court has the final say on the law not what you feel. the law say X the supreme court says the law say X it does not matter if you think the law means Y

[Rev. Rye]

no one is blindly defending the industry.
we are not over inflating the industry or the problem but assigning guilt/problem to the individuals who commit those crimes.

This may be a valid excuse when such things are rare as Hell, but when they're as common as they are (as in America), just taking the individual route where we treat each individual case like a whack-a-mole seems like a fruitless endeavour, at least, assuming you actually want to solve the problems.

Before you balk at my referring to gun deaths as common, just look at this table of countries by firearms death rate. While America's only #1 in the "number of guns per capita" and "suicides" tabs, we're still pretty high on total gun deaths and homicides. And just play around with the sortings: of all the countries who outrank America in total gun deaths and gun homicides, do you think you'd feel safe going around any of them? Or that Trump wouldn't call them shithole countries?

[Drich]

So why did they want a regulated militia?
Because it was supposed to be INSTEAD of a standing army.
So to keep your guns you should really get rid of your army.

Like I said, the Second Amendment was written for a time when America had a fundamentally different idea of how to defend itself than it does now (namely, each individual state had its own militia and it was still a question whether or not it was even possible or worthwhile to try and consolidate these militiae into a federal army, and even then, people were gravitating to "no"), and, while, technically, the definition of the "unorganised militia" is so broad it encompasses most every able-bodied man (and probably woman) to reach the age of 18, even that is a largely obsolete concept given that the few attacks on American soil since the Civil War have been so small-scale that there's been no need to invoke it. While it was likely a valuable right for the Constitution to protect back in 1787, 233 years later, it's become the inflamed appendix on the American body-politic, serving no purpose but to flare up and further sicken the nation.

see the above post and notation to the supreme court decision on how the amendment was intended to be interpreted. we do not have to guess or argue the supreme court tells us the official national position.. anything else is just conjecture.

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"Well regulated" meant "well drilled" or "well trained". They were supposed to be able to act like professional soldiers without getting paid for that. The Op-Ed pages of the day had fun with their "drills".

again does not matter as the law according to the supreme court extends past the militia and includes self and home defense.

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Buried in all of that horseshit, was the gem that you're convinced gun control dems are buying up all the gunstuff as their cities burn.

there are hunders of articles on this: https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/08...ica-today/ All contribute the shortage to first time gun buyers as being the primary reason for the shortage... who are the first time gun buyers? it is not he card carrying nra heavy right wing republicans. it is the middle of the road and even middle left 'dims.' most articles identify them even if they dont who else is buying guns for the first time?

[The Grand Nudger]

Another gem, you get your news from the gateway pundit, and that's lead you to believe that gun control dems are buying up all the gunstuff as their cities burn, because they would be the first time buyers™.

I wonder if there's a floor to this one?

[Drich]

no one is blindly defending the industry.
we are not over inflating the industry or the problem but assigning guilt/problem to the individuals who commit those crimes.

This may be a valid excuse when such things are rare as Hell, but when they're as common as they are (as in America), just taking the individual route where we treat each individual case like a whack-a-mole seems like a fruitless endeavour, at least, assuming you actually want to solve the problems.

Before you balk at my referring to gun deaths as common, just look at this table of countries by firearms death rate. While America's only #1 in the "number of guns per capita" and "suicides" tabs, we're still pretty high on total gun deaths and homicides. And just play around with the sortings: of all the countries who outrank America in total gun deaths and gun homicides, do you think you'd feel safe going around any of them? Or that Trump wouldn't call them shithole countries?

they are not in fact as common as the fake news portrays, but they do happen and they happen because again sheer ignorance and insensitivity to guns and gun violence. if every timmy had to shoot his old yeller when the dog got mortally sick or wounded then there would be a far greater respect for guns and their usage. this is what happens when you shield your children from everything, they grow up not respecting anything even life itself.

[The Grand Nudger]

Strange, shooting Timmy hasn't taught you any such lesson, why would shooting a dog teach them..and what would it teach them that shooting Timmy doesn't?

[Rev. Rye]

they are not in fact as common as the fake news portrays, but they do happen and they happen because again sheer ignorance and insensitivity to guns and gun violence. if every timmy had to shoot his old yeller when the dog got mortally sick or wounded then there would be a far greater respect for guns and their usage. this is what happens when you shield your children from everything, they grow up not respecting anything even life itself.

Which is why I used actual statistics and not news sources. Because news stories tend to not put individual stories into perspective to show how common gun deaths are per capita or how those rates tally against the rest of the world. And for America, we don’t do very well by any objective sense of the word. Unless, of course, one of your metrics for doing well involves “how fast do these people kill themselves or each other?”