Another story from the "Dumbass" files, me.

[Sal]

That has only happened a single time, AFAIK, to my forgetful ass at an ATM long ago. My sorry-ass mindful self tried to invent a bunch of excuses for why I had not retrieved the money from that ATM, but the simple reason is that I wasn't centered about what the fuck I was doing there, and my mind, while I was in front of the ATM wandered off into some distant thought wherever, while physically there. The old "The lights are on, but no one is home" springs to mind.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

They changed ATMs a few years back so that your card is spit back out so you don't forget it.  I guess they figured people would remember their cash as being the most important reason for using an ATM.  

How do you figure it's a crime to take the money?  If you find twenty bucks on the ground and pick it up, you haven't committed a crime.  You basically did the same thing as dropping your money on the ground.

It was a dumb ass move.  Maybe you really should consider some meds for your ADHD now that it's costing you money.

Actually, it is a crime - theft by finding. If you find, for example, a wallet lying in the ground, you’re expected to take reasonable steps to find the owner. An exception would be if the property has been clearly and obviously abandoned (as opposed to lost), such as a book found at the local tip, or a piece of furniture left out on the kerb for waste collection.

In Brian’s case, whoever took his money would have been legally obligated to tell the bank, since cash left in an ATM slot isn’t obviously abandoned.

Boru

[arewethereyet]

How do you figure it's a crime to take the money?  If you find twenty bucks on the ground and pick it up, you haven't committed a crime.  You basically did the same thing as dropping your money on the ground.

There's no grounds to believe the money was "lost" and finding the owner would be as easy as taking the money to the bank and explaining how you found it. In most places in the US if you "find" money you are required to surrender it to the police and wait a specific period, 30-90 days. If nobody claims it with evidence then you get it.

It's not a crime.  

Who are the "they" who require you to surrender found money?  Any time there's a nickel on the ground do you have to surrender it to the police?  Or is there a dollar amount attached to this "requirement"?

[Brian37]

They changed ATMs a few years back so that your card is spit back out so you don't forget it.  I guess they figured people would remember their cash as being the most important reason for using an ATM.  

How do you figure it's a crime to take the money?  If you find twenty bucks on the ground and pick it up, you haven't committed a crime.  You basically did the same thing as dropping your money on the ground.

It was a dumb ass move.  Maybe you really should consider some meds for your ADHD now that it's costing you money.

Actually, it is a crime - theft by finding. If you find, for example, a wallet lying in the ground, you’re expected to take reasonable steps to find the owner. An exception would be if the property has been clearly and obviously abandoned (as opposed to lost), such as a book found at the local tip, or a piece of furniture left out on the kerb for waste collection.

In Brian’s case, whoever took his money would have been legally obligated to tell the bank, since cash left in an ATM slot isn’t obviously abandoned.

Boru

It was still in the machine, hanging slightly out, it cannot be considered abandon if the machine itself has a mechanism to pull the money back in. The only way I see it can be considered abandon, is if it fell off the machine to the ground. But I can tell you, at least with the machines I have used, the machine has a slight grip on the money and it won't fall out. 

Someone had to pull that money out of the machine. 

The money slightly hanging out of the machine, would be like your chair or couch being half way in, half way out of your front door. For something to be abandon, it has to be fully out on the curb. Try taking someone's furniture off their front porch, after all, it is outside. Huge difference between a front porch and a curb.

https://www.quora.com/If-you-find-money-...st-take-it

^^^^^^^^^^^ Lawyer speaking in general terms. 

Quote ELLEN, "Generally misplaced property still belongs to the original owner and must be returned".

AND quote ELLEN, "Money which is still in the ATM is forgotten or mislaid. It will belong to the person who withdrew it."

She also makes a distinction between forgotten and abandon.

I read that as the money still having an establishment of ownership because it is still partially in the machine. If it were on the ground that would be a different story.  So Boru is right. 

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There's no grounds to believe the money was "lost" and finding the owner would be as easy as taking the money to the bank and explaining how you found it. In most places in the US if you "find" money you are required to surrender it to the police and wait a specific period, 30-90 days. If nobody claims it with evidence then you get it.

It's not a crime.  

Who are the "they" who require you to surrender found money?  Any time there's a nickel on the ground do you have to surrender it to the police?  Or is there a dollar amount attached to this "requirement"?

Finding a nickel on the ground isn't the same as taking money still partially in an ATM someone left.

There still is a reasonable establishment as to where the source of ownership has been established. You may not know the individual who forgot it, but the bank can figure that out through their computers and cameras. So you do have an obligation to take it to the bank, tell them what time you found it. Or take it to the police.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

There's no grounds to believe the money was "lost" and finding the owner would be as easy as taking the money to the bank and explaining how you found it. In most places in the US if you "find" money you are required to surrender it to the police and wait a specific period, 30-90 days. If nobody claims it with evidence then you get it.

It's not a crime.  

Who are the "they" who require you to surrender found money?  Any time there's a nickel on the ground do you have to surrender it to the police?  Or is there a dollar amount attached to this "requirement"?

It IS a crime.

Theft By Finding

People have been successfully prosecuted for it.

Boru

[Gawdzilla Sama]

There's no grounds to believe the money was "lost" and finding the owner would be as easy as taking the money to the bank and explaining how you found it. In most places in the US if you "find" money you are required to surrender it to the police and wait a specific period, 30-90 days. If nobody claims it with evidence then you get it.

It's not a crime.  

Who are the "they" who require you to surrender found money?  Any time there's a nickel on the ground do you have to surrender it to the police?  Or is there a dollar amount attached to this "requirement"?

If you find a pile of money you are fully aware that you are not the owner. Do I need to go from there?

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

And it’s not just money. If you find a piece of property - a hat, for example - you are required to make a reasonable effort to find the owner.

Suppose you’re at a public place and you leave your mobile phone on a park bench while you go to use the lavvy (stupid thing to do, but that’s not the point). I come along and say, ‘Cool, an abandoned phone!’ and walk off with it. That’s theft, because there’s no reasonable way to assume that you simply didn’t want your phone anymore.

The converse of that is when property is CLEARLY abandoned, then it’s a case of help yourself. Back it NI, I once left a pile of scrap at the kerb on collection day. It was junk (split pieces, water damage, etc). I happened to look out the window later and saw a women loading the wood into the boot of her car. That’s not theft.

Boru

[Brian37]

It's not a crime.  

Who are the "they" who require you to surrender found money?  Any time there's a nickel on the ground do you have to surrender it to the police?  Or is there a dollar amount attached to this "requirement"?

If you find a pile of money you are fully aware that you are not the owner. Do I need to go from there?

Back when I was 7 years old, my dad and I were walking from our VW van, through the marina to the docks where his boat was. I saw in front of me off slightly in the distance, what I thought was just a piece of paper, but when I got closer too it I saw that it was a $10 dollar bill. I picked up and said, "Look what I found dad." My dad said, "Let me hold that for you." I never saw it again.  

But there is no reasonable way one could track down the person who dropped it because it wasn't like it was in a wallet. But you are right, lets say it wasn't just one lost bill with no way to trace the owner. If it were say, several hundreds of dollars in a purse with no ID or in a money clip, then even without the ID it makes sense that one should take it to the police. 

But money hanging partially out of an ATM is different. There is a much easier path to returning it to the rightful owner, through reporting it to the bank.

---

And it’s not just money. If you find a piece of property - a hat, for example - you are required to make a reasonable effort to find the owner.

Suppose you’re at a public place and you leave your mobile phone on a park bench while you go to use the lavvy (stupid thing to do, but that’s not the point). I come along and say, ‘Cool, an abandoned phone!’ and walk off with it. That’s theft, because there’s no reasonable way to assume that you simply didn’t want your phone anymore.

The converse of that is when property is CLEARLY abandoned, then it’s a case of help yourself. Back it NI, I once left a pile of scrap at the kerb on collection day. It was junk (split pieces, water damage, etc). I happened to look out the window later and saw a women loading the wood into the boot of her car. That’s not theft.

Boru

^^^^^^^^ Agreed. 

Money hanging partially out of an ATM cannot be considered abandon as in, "I don't want this money" like putting trash on the curb.

Even in police investigations, if you are a suspect in a crime, and you throw evidence in the trash, it is perfectly legal for the police to go through your trash without a warrant because it is considered abandon. What the police cannot do, without probable cause is illegally enter your house car, private property and look for the same thing without probable cause or a warrant.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

The law seldom makes reasonable demands from us.

[onlinebiker]

The law seldom makes reasonable demands from us.

In Michigan - at an uncontrolled intersection (such as 4 way stop signs) the right of way belongs to the first vehicle to enter the intersection.

No shit.

Gentlemen - start your engines...


What could go wrong?