(December 28, 2015 at 2:28 am)Huggy74 Wrote:

(December 27, 2015 at 11:16 pm)Evie Wrote: Who gives a fuck what Paul says?

Why care what anyone says then? Better yet, why are you even part of the discussion?

When are you going to answer the question about why you believe in an ethnocentric Middle Eastern Jewish religious fairy tale if you aren't a Jew?

Huggy, like most theists, do not answer. They merely illogically respond.

(December 28, 2015 at 2:28 am)Huggy74 Wrote:

(December 27, 2015 at 11:16 pm)Evie Wrote: Who gives a fuck what Paul says?

Why care what anyone says then? Better yet, why are you even part of the discussion?

I just wanted to point out the logical fallacy you committed. You responded by telling me something Paul says. Either way you still committed a fallacy. That's all. Laterz

(December 26, 2015 at 8:34 pm)IanHulett Wrote: I've been saying islam is pathetically evil... because it says to convert or kill the nonbelievers... but little did I know... the holy bible has the same thing...
Proverbs 8:36 "But if you wrong me, you damage your very soul; when you reject me, you’re flirting with death.”

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se...ersion=MSG

According to Phil Robertson... that means convert or kill the nonbelievers... 

Observe: https://youtu.be/NuJF4KJVftQ?t=2m36s

Fastforward to 2m 36s

Either phil robertson is mighty fucking insane... or his bible REALLY says convert or kill the nonbelievers, just like islam(Or both)... if that's true... boy, am I mighty fucking glad I'm an atheist...

I will admit, I never read the whole bible... it's too boring to get past the first couple of pages in genesis... so I am not familiar with ALL the lies and fear mongering that's in it.... I'm aware of some of it... but not all... I'm certainly aware of enough to decide Christianity is definitely not a religion I want any part in...

I probably wouldn't take my cues on theology or biblical exegesis - or any topic for that matter - from a hilly billy bumpkin like Phil Robertson.

While there are many instances of verses in the OT similar to the one you relate, the interpretation he draws from that passage would appear to be a bit of a stretch.

(December 26, 2015 at 8:34 pm)IanHulett Wrote: I've been saying islam is pathetically evil... because it says to convert or kill the nonbelievers... but little did I know... the holy bible has the same thing...
Proverbs 8:36 "But if you wrong me, you damage your very soul; when you reject me, you’re flirting with death.”

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se...ersion=MSG

According to Phil Robertson... that means convert or kill the nonbelievers... 

Observe: https://youtu.be/NuJF4KJVftQ?t=2m36s

Fastforward to 2m 36s

Either phil robertson is mighty fucking insane... or his bible REALLY says convert or kill the nonbelievers, just like islam(Or both)... if that's true... boy, am I mighty fucking glad I'm an atheist...

I will admit, I never read the whole bible... it's too boring to get past the first couple of pages in genesis... so I am not familiar with ALL the lies and fear mongering that's in it.... I'm aware of some of it... but not all... I'm certainly aware of enough to decide Christianity is definitely not a religion I want any part in...

So.... A Passage in PROVERBS= a command to kill non believers.

First do you know what the word Proverb means? it's an english word that means a short pithy saying or piece of general advise. Like a penny saved is a penny earned, or early to bed early to rise, an apple aday etc...

Now if one were to actually read proverbs 8 one could see "Wisdom" is what is being described in the first person.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se...ersion=ERV

35 Those who find me find life,
    and the Lord will reward them.
36 But those who do not find me put their lives in danger.
    Whoever hates me loves death.”

Remember the writer of this proverb was talking to the OT Jew. Their wasn't a Jesus nor is this a prophesy. Again if you read from the beginning to the end of this proverb you will see the writer is describing one's relationship with wisdom.

"If you find wisdom you will find life, and God will reward them if you do not find wisom, or hates wisdom loves death."

Again simply read the passage from beginning to end.

As far as Phil goes he is hard core Church of Christ. They are... Legalistic meaning they are hard right wing fringe of Christianity.

(December 28, 2015 at 1:42 pm)Drich Wrote:

(December 26, 2015 at 8:34 pm)IanHulett Wrote: I've been saying islam is pathetically evil... because it says to convert or kill the nonbelievers... but little did I know... the holy bible has the same thing...
Proverbs 8:36 "But if you wrong me, you damage your very soul; when you reject me, you’re flirting with death.”

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se...ersion=MSG

According to Phil Robertson... that means convert or kill the nonbelievers... 

Observe: https://youtu.be/NuJF4KJVftQ?t=2m36s

Fastforward to 2m 36s

Either phil robertson is mighty fucking insane... or his bible REALLY says convert or kill the nonbelievers, just like islam(Or both)... if that's true... boy, am I mighty fucking glad I'm an atheist...

I will admit, I never read the whole bible... it's too boring to get past the first couple of pages in genesis... so I am not familiar with ALL the lies and fear mongering that's in it.... I'm aware of some of it... but not all... I'm certainly aware of enough to decide Christianity is definitely not a religion I want any part in...

So.... A Passage in PROVERBS= a command to kill non believers.

First do you know what the word Proverb means? it's an english word that means a short pithy saying or piece of general advise. Like a penny saved is a penny earned, or early to bed early to rise, an apple aday etc...

Now if one were to actually read proverbs 8 one could see "Wisdom" is what is being described in the first person.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se...ersion=ERV

35 Those who find me find life,
    and the Lord will reward them.
36 But those who do not find me put their lives in danger.
    Whoever hates me loves death.”

Remember the writer of this proverb was talking to the OT Jew. Their wasn't a Jesus nor is this a prophesy. Again if you read from the beginning to the end of this proverb you will see the writer is describing one's relationship with wisdom.

"If you find wisdom you will find life, and God will reward them if you do not find wisom, or hates wisdom loves death."

Again simply read the passage from beginning to end.

That's an interpretation though... it's just as valid as Phil Robertsons "convert or kill nonbelievers" interpretation... and that isn't saying much. Every religious person has their own interpretation of the bible and that played a part in forming the thousands of christian denominations. 

The problem with interpretation, is that you can literally pick a bible passage and twist it to fit your beliefs. For example, some people respond to the slavery thing in the bible
 by saying that we shouldn't take the bible word for word. That's a pathetic cop out.

And as for hating god means loving death... that's a false dichotomy. Just because I hate the character of god due to the atrocities committed in the bible, doesn't mean I want to die. Can you imagine if someone said to you "You hate voldemort from Harry Potter, therefore you must love death"?

(December 28, 2015 at 4:05 am)Evie Wrote:

(December 28, 2015 at 2:28 am)Huggy74 Wrote: Why care what anyone says then? Better yet, why are you even part of the discussion?

I just wanted to point out the logical fallacy you committed. You responded by telling me something Paul says. Either way you still committed a fallacy. That's all. Laterz

I've committed no "fallacy", a word you atheists seem to pull out whenever you have no argument.

The "Jews" that you guys are used to seeing are ASHKENAZI Jews, and are NOT descended from the Jews of the Bible.

Surprise: Ashkenazi Jews Are Genetically European

Quote:The origin of the Ashkenazi Jews, who come most recently from Europe, has largely been shrouded in mystery. But a new study suggests that at least their maternal lineage may derive largely from Europe.

Though the finding may seem intuitive, it contradicts the notion that European Jews mostly descend from people who left Israel and the Middle East around 2,000 years ago. Instead, a substantial proportion of the population originates from local Europeans who converted to Judaism, said study co-author Martin Richards, an archaeogeneticist at the University of Huddersfield in England.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews

Quote:It is estimated that in the 11th century Ashkenazi Jews composed only three percent of the world's Jewish population, while at their peak in 1931 they accounted for 92 percent of the world's Jews. Immediately prior to the Holocaust, the number of Jews in the world stood at approximately 16.7 million.

Again, the word "Jew" originally referenced the people of the tribe of Judah, it had nothing to do with religion.

(December 28, 2015 at 2:37 am)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote: When are you going to answer the question about why you believe in an ethnocentric Middle Eastern Jewish religious fairy tale if you aren't a Jew?

Quote:Romans 4
13 It was not through the law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.
14 For if those who depend on the law are heirs, faith means nothing and the promise is worthless,
15 because the law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression.
16 Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.
17 As it is written: “I have made you a father of many nations.”[c] He is our father in the sight of God, in whom he believed—the God who gives life to the dead and calls into being things that were not.

Quote:Galatians 3:7
Understand, then, that those who have faith are children of Abraham.

Quote:The point I was making is that the word "Jew" originally referred to an ethnic group, not a religion.... YOU CAN'T CONVERT TO AN ETHNICITY.

got it?

Hey, asswipe.  The word "Yehud" originally referred to a region not an ethnic group.  They were ethnically all fucking Canaanites.  The "Jews" were a political creation of the Persian empire.  And as far as not converting to it....tell it to the Hasmonean kings at the end of the first century.  They'd gladly take a piece of your dick off.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aristobulu...of_Galilee

Quote:Much of the Galilee region was annexed by Aristobulus, however, there was some resistance from the Arab Ituraean tribes from the northern parts of the region. The terrain made campaigning difficult against the Galilee inhabitants. In the end, Aristobulus would eventually conquer much of the territory from them.[9]The Golan region was also taken during the campaign and Mount Hermon as well.[10][11][8] The conquered inhabitants were forced to accept the Jewish faith, primarily, circumcision was forcibly performed as the first step to conversion.

http://www.britannica.com/biography/John-Hyrcanus-I

Quote:He forced Idumaea to convert to Judaism, the first example of conversion imposed by the Jews in their history. Upon his death Hyrcanus was succeeded by his eldest son, Aristobulus I. Hyrcanus’ reign was the last under which Judaea was a powerful, united state.

As a matter of fact, the practice continues to this day....without being done at sword point.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conversion_to_Judaism

Quote:Conversion to Judaism (Hebrew: גיור‎, giyur) is a formal act undertaken by a non-Jewish person who wishes to be recognized as a full member of a Jewish community. A Jewish conversion is normally a series of religious acts and studies, including an expression of association with the Jewish people and, sometimes, the Land of Israel.[1][2][3] A formal conversion is also sometimes undertaken to remove any doubt as to the Jewishness of a person who wishes to be considered a Jew.

Do you ever bother to learn what are you are talking about or do you just spit out the first thing that pops out of your ass?

(December 29, 2015 at 10:23 pm)Huggy74 Wrote:

---

(December 28, 2015 at 4:05 am)Evie Wrote: I just wanted to point out the logical fallacy you committed. You responded by telling me something Paul says. Either way you still committed a fallacy. That's all. Laterz

I've committed no "fallacy", a word you atheists seem to pull out whenever you have no argument.

The "Jews" that you guys are used to seeing are ASHKENAZI Jews, and are NOT descended from the Jews of the Bible.

Surprise: Ashkenazi Jews Are Genetically European

Quote:The origin of the Ashkenazi Jews, who come most recently from Europe, has largely been shrouded in mystery. But a new study suggests that at least their maternal lineage may derive largely from Europe.

Though the finding may seem intuitive, it contradicts the notion that European Jews mostly descend from people who left Israel and the Middle East around 2,000 years ago. Instead, a substantial proportion of the population originates from local Europeans who converted to Judaism, said study co-author Martin Richards, an archaeogeneticist at the University of Huddersfield in England.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews

Quote:It is estimated that in the 11th century Ashkenazi Jews composed only three percent of the world's Jewish population, while at their peak in 1931 they accounted for 92 percent of the world's Jews. Immediately prior to the Holocaust, the number of Jews in the world stood at approximately 16.7 million.

Again, the word "Jew" originally referenced the people of the tribe of Judah, it had nothing to do with religion.

---

Quote:

(December 28, 2015 at 2:37 am)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote: When are you going to answer the question about why you believe in an ethnocentric Middle Eastern Jewish religious fairy tale if you aren't a Jew?

Quote:Romans 4
13 It was not through the law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.
14 For if those who depend on the law are heirs, faith means nothing and the promise is worthless, 15 because the law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression.
16 Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.
17 As it is written: “I have made you a father of many nations.”[c] He is our father in the sight of God, in whom he believed—the God who gives life to the dead and calls into being things that were not.

Quote:Galatians 3:7
Understand, then, that those who have faith are children of Abraham.

Abraham is the most disgusting character in the Bible.  He has no redeeming qualities.  If you want to claim him as your daddy you're welcome to him.