(March 23, 2018 at 8:32 am)chimp3 Wrote:

(March 23, 2018 at 6:47 am)Banned Wrote: In the scheme of evolution...why is it such a crime to advance the fiercest criminal species over the docile?

If you can not answer this question yourself, then you are a worthless shit head!

So you are calling for a standard, when standards are just made up by people, who will have absolutely no say of anything in life once they pass away.

Does it matter now what some monkey did 2 million years ago?

Will it matter what you and I did in 2 million years, or even in the few years after death?

It doesn't matter if you do star jumps on the beach every day, grinning from ear to ear, you will be rolled over into the dust and be less than a pause in the breeze.

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(March 23, 2018 at 8:57 am)Astreja Wrote:

(March 23, 2018 at 6:47 am)Banned Wrote: So why is it such a crime to advance the fiercest criminal species over the docile?

Because it makes our lives unpleasant, filled with anger and fear, and reduces the quality of life for everyone across the board.

Believing as I do that life is short and precious, with nothing awaiting us after our deaths, I strive to live for quality rather than quantity.  I feel sad when other people are hurting, and happy when they are happy.  It just makes sense to play nice and try to improve everyone's lives, rather than living a smash-and-grab existence.

The so called criminal and the well meaning citizen are no different in their fate, or their status once they're gone.
Why play nice when it gives someone a thrill to kill?

Whole cities full of Mansons won't matter once they're gone.
Whole cities full of icecream lickers won't matter either.

How can anything be a crime, unless it's just the social norm at the time?

You don't need an absolute objective universal standard of length to discern which of two threads is the longest. You don't need an absolute objective universal standard of morality to discern which of two actions is more moral.

Certain moral statements seem to be true for humans in all circumstances, like 'it's wrong to torture innocent people just for your own amusement'. Why is it wrong? 'God says so' does not answer that question.

Quote:So you are calling for a standard, when standards are just made up by people, who will have absolutely no say of anything in life once they pass away.

Yup moral are invented by people and we don't get a say after we die and your point?

Quote:Does it matter now what some monkey did 2 million years ago?

Yup it does 

Quote:Will it matter what you and I did in 2 million years, or even in the few years after death?

Yup

Quote:It doesn't matter if you do star jumps on the beach every day, grinning from ear to ear, you will be rolled over into the dust and be less than a pause in the breeze

Yes it does even if that's your fate 

Quote:The so called criminal and the well meaning citizen are no different in their fate, or their status once they're gone.
Why play nice when it gives someone a thrill to kill?

Yup both die .And your second question is so stupid i won't dignify it with an answer .

Quote:Whole cities full of Mansons won't matter once they're gone.

Yes they will 

Quote:Whole cities full of icecream lickers won't matter either.

Yes they will 

Quote:How can anything be a crime, unless it's just the social norm at the time?

Fuck your dense

(March 23, 2018 at 5:01 pm)Banned Wrote:

(March 23, 2018 at 8:32 am)chimp3 Wrote: If you can not answer this question yourself, then you are a worthless shit head!

So you are calling for a standard, when standards are just made up by people, who will have absolutely no say of anything in life once they pass away.

Does it matter now what some monkey did 2 million years ago?

Will it matter what you and I did in 2 million years, or even in the few years after death?

It doesn't matter if you do star jumps on the beach every day, grinning from ear to ear, you will be rolled over into the dust and be less than a pause in the breeze.

---

All moral standards are "just made up by people". You are the one here that is lacking in meaning and purpose. Without your religious crutch you do not have the imagination for anything but despair. Myself, I am an optimist.

Why moral are invented but none the less true 

https://www.richardcarrier.info/page/6


Objective moral facts 

https://www.richardcarrier.info/archives/13558


Objective moral facts in nature 

https://www.richardcarrier.info/archives/9770


Moral reasoning 

https://www.richardcarrier.info/archives/13819


Alvin being humiliated for using  Banned moronic moral reasoning 

https://www.richardcarrier.info/archives/13694


Ray Comfort being humiliated by using Banned moral reasoning 

https://www.richardcarrier.info/archives/13558


Other issues 

https://www.richardcarrier.info/archives/12882



You don't understand shit Banned so kindly stop making a fool of yourself

(March 23, 2018 at 6:19 pm)chimp3 Wrote: All moral standards are "just made up by people". You are the one here that is lacking in meaning and purpose. Without your religious crutch you do not have the imagination for anything but despair. Myself, I am an optimist.

So what does it matter what you imagine?

How is imagining something positive any different from something negative when you will be nothing, and the memory of you won't exist, and even if it does, then you aren't there to enjoy it?

What is considered a crime today may not ever be an issue in the future, if there is one that's permanent.

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(March 23, 2018 at 6:01 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: You don't need an absolute objective universal standard of length to discern which of two threads is the longest. You don't need an absolute objective universal standard of morality to discern which of two actions is more moral.

Certain moral statements seem to be true for humans in all circumstances, like 'it's wrong to torture innocent people just for your own amusement'. Why is it wrong? 'God says so' does not answer that question.

Amoral is the word.

Fuck your stupid banned 

(March 23, 2018 at 6:28 pm)Banned Wrote:

(March 23, 2018 at 6:19 pm)chimp3 Wrote: All moral standards are "just made up by people". You are the one here that is lacking in meaning and purpose. Without your religious crutch you do not have the imagination for anything but despair. Myself, I am an optimist.

So what does it matter what you imagine?

How is imagining something positive any different from something negative when you will be nothing, and the memory of you won't exist, and even if it does, then you aren't there to enjoy it?

What is considered a crime today may not ever be an issue in the future, if there is one that's permanent.

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"What is considered a crime today may not ever be an issue in the future, if there is one that's permanent."

Exactly! Hopefully some things which are crimes today will not be an issue in the future. Some countries have blasphemy laws. The end of those can not come soon enough. Marijuana laws need to go. Laws against humans marrying humans of the same sex need to go.

(March 23, 2018 at 6:25 pm)Tizheruk Wrote: You don't understand shit Banned so kindly stop making a fool of yourself

How does anything you say matter?

Aren't you set up for oblivion?

Or do you "imagine" something more grand?

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(March 23, 2018 at 6:36 pm)chimp3 Wrote: "What is considered a crime today may not ever be an issue in the future, if there is one that's permanent."

Exactly! Hopefully some things which are crimes today will not be an issue in the future. Some countries have blasphemy laws. The end of those can not come soon enough. Marijuana laws need to go. Laws against humans marrying humans of the same sex need to go.

You are thinking short term again. And if there is a resolved future bliss, then you won't be part of it, and even that state for the future citizens will only last for a generation if that.

If we go by facts alone, such as history, without considering utopian fantasies, we have what we have.

(March 23, 2018 at 6:42 pm)Banned Wrote:

(March 23, 2018 at 6:25 pm)Tizheruk Wrote: You don't understand shit Banned so kindly stop making a fool of yourself

How does anything you say matter?

Aren't you set up for oblivion?

Or do you "imagine" something more grand?

People make things matter. Civil rights for instance. Equality of the races, sexes. We make them matter by struggling for them, arguing for them. No room for pessimists, if you can't be part of the solution, then please refrain from depressing the problem solvers with your doom and gloom.

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(March 23, 2018 at 6:42 pm)Banned Wrote:

(March 23, 2018 at 6:25 pm)Tizheruk Wrote: You don't understand shit Banned so kindly stop making a fool of yourself

How does anything you say matter?

Aren't you set up for oblivion?

Or do you "imagine" something more grand?

---

(March 23, 2018 at 6:36 pm)chimp3 Wrote: "What is considered a crime today may not ever be an issue in the future, if there is one that's permanent."

Exactly! Hopefully some things which are crimes today will not be an issue in the future. Some countries have blasphemy laws. The end of those can not come soon enough. Marijuana laws need to go. Laws against humans marrying humans of the same sex need to go.

You are thinking short term again. And if there is a resolved future bliss, then you won't be part of it, and even that state for the future citizens will only last for generation if that.

If we go by facts alone, such as history, without considering utopian fantasies, we have what we have.

No room for pessimists.