I’d be like, a 6.5.

(August 21, 2018 at 9:46 am)vulcanlogician Wrote:

(August 21, 2018 at 8:59 am)Aegon Wrote: I feel like I'm as positive as I can be that there is no god. That should br 7, not 6, no? The idea that "we can't know for sure" is giving in to one of religions' many logical exemptions. Would you really say the same about other things besides God?

I don't think it's a logical exemption. Nor is it "giving in." It's reasonable to approach unknowns with a skeptical attitude. Skepticism is neither denial nor belief, but suspension in between until solid evidence is provided.

Claiming certainty where there is insufficient evidence is for theists. I'd like to think we're better than that.

I think the problem is that there is an equivocation about the word 'know'. This word is context dependent. Like I could know where I put the car keys, but I don't really know 100% because I don't know that someone hasn't stolen them from my handbag last time I went to the toilet. But if we only ever used the word 'know' when we had that level of certainty then we'd never actually use it. The word has to be useful. So my argument is that saying that we do not know that a god exists is to use this non-useful context of the word 'know'.

Because whatever commonly held definition of god you decide upon will violate or contradict what we know to be true even more so. Therefore I am happy to say that I know that gods do not exist. In the same way that I also know that (spoiler alert) Santa Claus and the tooth fairy does not exist.

(August 21, 2018 at 9:16 am)vulcanlogician Wrote: Like I said in the other thread: "God exists" is not a falsifiable hypothesis. Therefore complete certainty can never be obtained.

I disagree.

Quote:Claiming certainty where there is insufficient evidence is for theists. I'd like to think we're better than that.

Is there insufficient evidence to conclude that gods exist as pomp in narratives built around the hazy perceptions of the human mind?  Or.... even..that they are a physical product of biological origin?  I don't think so.  

They're asking me whether or not bigfoot exists... while pointing at their cat.  

Now, sure, we could rabbit hole what ifs such as "but what if it's also that other thing that i assert it is!".  They're wondering about the cat, and after having had it explained to them that it is a cat, this is simply the insistence that maybe cats are also bigfoot.  The moon might also, somehow, be made out of cheese and rock and not be the moon..simultaneously.  

We can never know, right? 

Comments regarding the availability of knowledge aren't exactly specific to god questions. Those are general complaints that people either do or don't find compelling...or, more commonly in the god context, do -and- don't find compelling out of convenience. It makes about as much sense to claim that "the sun exists" is an unfalsifiable hypothesis and we can never know for certain. Maybe the sun is also the rock and cheese moon..except when it's not (but even then!!!)!...but that the existence of god is falsifiable, can be known, and is true.

-ad infinitum

Me, I'm just going to note that the ticks of our mind are not timeless, they do not create or sustain this world or this universe, they have no divine ability whatsoever. They aren't living in the sacred woods or residing in the effigy, they don't fill a sacred temple with their presence...they don't grant wishes, they don't run a themepark for the dead, they aren't watching me pee..or shake it more the the approved number of times. They hear no prayers and answer no appeals. They favor no particular moral screed, they write no magic books. They have no agency whatsoever...hell..we're barely scraping by on that as a whole being, lol.

So..no, point of fact, gods don't exist, I know it, because of what I know about gods...not because of what I don't or, allegedly..can't.

Does anyone here is agnostic towards popular God's that practice torture?

(August 21, 2018 at 10:19 am)purplepurpose Wrote: Does anyone here is agnostic towards popular God's that practice torture?

Does Bruno Mars is gay?

I'm so sorry but I had to...

I'm a 7 towards gods that are logically impossible.

A 6.9 toward most deistic, pantheistic and panentheistic gods.

But I'm not really a fan the Dawkins scale.

I hate this stupid fucking scale with the white-hot fury of 1000 exploding suns.

Boru

(August 21, 2018 at 10:55 am)Simon Moon Wrote: I'm a 7 towards gods that are logically impossible.

A 6.9 toward most deistic, pantheistic and panentheistic gods.

But I'm not really a fan the Dawkins scale.

Yeah I also lean towards a 37.644 in regards to the Dawkins scale

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(August 21, 2018 at 10:56 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: I hate this stupid fucking scale with the white-hot fury of 1000 exploding suns.

Boru

Meanwhile, look at Brian here going full 37.998 on it. Never go 37.998

I am a 6.

Oh, on The Dawkins scale?

I am a 6.

I've been a 6.999... for a while. Previous position, approximately ten years ago, was hovering between 3 and 5 (usually closer to a 5).