(December 20, 2018 at 8:30 am)Maketakunai Wrote: All the noise about ISIS and humanitarian efforts has always just been a pretense. We're only there for oil. ISIS will be around for a long time because they're fanatics. Let someone else keep them in check for a while. The only question we should be concerned with is whether or not that oil is worth all the aggravation. If the goal is to use less oil, pollute less, and save the planet from global warming (or whatever) then pulling out of Syria would seem to be a step in the right direction.

Unless of course Elon Musk, the political left, and all the climate change alarmists are all wrong and we really do need the oil...

Based on 2015 production statistics, Syria produced 30K barrels/day (ranked 66th), the U.S. produced 9.41M barrels/day (ranked 3rd).  I have seen recent article claiming that the U.S. is now the number one oil producing nation.  The U.S. is most assuredly not in Syria for the oil.

(December 20, 2018 at 9:00 am)Brian37 Wrote:

(December 20, 2018 at 8:42 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Damned if we do, damned if we don't.

This isn't the President weighing anything either way, this is just his shitting his pants because the wheels are coming off of his con.

Didn't say anything about that.

---

(December 20, 2018 at 9:40 am)Cato Wrote:

(December 20, 2018 at 8:30 am)Maketakunai Wrote: All the noise about ISIS and humanitarian efforts has always just been a pretense. We're only there for oil. ISIS will be around for a long time because they're fanatics. Let someone else keep them in check for a while. The only question we should be concerned with is whether or not that oil is worth all the aggravation. If the goal is to use less oil, pollute less, and save the planet from global warming (or whatever) then pulling out of Syria would seem to be a step in the right direction.

Unless of course Elon Musk, the political left, and all the climate change alarmists are all wrong and we really do need the oil...

Based on 2015 production statistics, Syria produced 30K barrels/day (ranked 66th), the U.S. produced 9.41M barrels/day (ranked 3rd).  I have seen recent article claiming that the U.S. is now the number one oil producing nation.  The U.S. is most assuredly not in Syria for the oil.

We're currently a net exporter of oil.

(December 20, 2018 at 9:39 am)Brian37 Wrote:

(December 20, 2018 at 9:25 am)onlinebiker Wrote: You wouldn't say " meh" were you one of those 2000....

Nice dodge. I have been consistent in saying that global policy cannot be either isolation or colonialism, but case by case.

As far as Bush's two wars, a drone strike without announcement could have taken out Bin Laden instead of an invasion of Afghanistan. Iraq Dick Cheney lied his way into. Bush Sr's  first Iraq war I agreed with although I wish he had finished the job back then, because we were invited and our allies had our backs in the first Gulf War. The problem with pulling out after you commit is that you risk creating a power vacuum and resentment on top of that by the people you claimed to have wanted to help.

45 is inept and dangerous. Putin is playing him and so are the Saudis and North Korea.

No service member wants to be in the line of fire. That makes it paramount for the leadership in control of our military to be competent and understand the weight of risk, of going in, staying in and leaving. I will laugh in your face if you think the current occupant of the White House understands his responsibility, especially after ignoring his own intel on Russia and North Korea.

45 is simply pulling another distraction because the walls are closing in on him and his family.

Zark off.

Those 2000 troops get to come home - and you don't give a shit...


That' s because you were never one of them.


You were too busy writing bad pooetry in your momma' s basement.


Yeah - pooetry....

Shit poetry.

It's a shame that we've decided to give up where we should persist, and persist where there is nothing to be gained. Decisions like these shame the uniform.

I don't see it as so much of a military issue as a political one. Yes, 2000 troops is a small commitment, compared to other US deployments, so it really isn't a question of weakening Syria.  Yes, Syria doesn't supply enough of the world's oil to make it an economic issue.

But for the US to remove even a token force isn't going to accomplish much more than strengthening Russian and Iranian influence in the region.  Additionally, the suddenness of this move makes it apparent that Trump is trying to distract attention for a couple of disastrous political weeks.  What message does this send to your allies beyond, 'US commitments mean nothing, if the President needs a shiny object'?

'America First' is well on the way to becoming 'American Alone'.

Boru

Quote:Those 2000 troops get to come home

Not to be harsh about it, but what is the point of having troops if you aren't going to deploy them?

Boru

(December 20, 2018 at 7:51 am)Nakara Wrote: Donald Trump pulls out of a lot of things it seems

Though, not often enough. 😏

(December 20, 2018 at 12:40 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote:

(December 20, 2018 at 7:51 am)Nakara Wrote: Donald Trump pulls out of a lot of things it seems

Though, not often enough. 😏

True, three bratty self entitled kids. One can only hope Barron turns out like Ron Jr.

Trump defends Mohammed Bin Salman so that he can use him against Iran. But then he pulls out of Syria to leave it wide open for the Iranians. Trump is nothing but a madman who doesn't know whether he's coming and going. He needs a distraction from the Mueller stories and the government shutdown he intends to cause, so he's manufacturing another story to occupy the news cycle. It's nothing more than the micro-managing of his image that any good narcissist spends his or her time doing when they could be doing something productive.

Boru,
I understand your points and there is some merit, but I see things differently.

I don't think the 2000 troop presence in Syria does anything to lessen the relationship between Putin and Assad or Syria's ties to Iran for that matter. Syria is boxed in by Turkey, Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Israel (intentionally ignoring Jordan and Lebanon) so I put a lot less emphasis on the importance this contingent contributes to regional stability.. I don't think this is sufficient reason for troops to remain.

Your Trump distraction theory has more merit, but Trump has been after the NSC and Mattis for some time about withdrawal, he's been ignored. To me this seems more of an end around to sniff out popular support to get his way than an intentional distraction to the investigation news. I can't dismiss this though, although it's certainly less of a distraction than bombing African pharmaceutical sites.

The purpose of having troops is not to find them an occupation on foreign soil. The idea is to have a ready force for defense, an idea that has been forgotten for sometime and needs restoring. If I could have my way I would remove troops from Afghanistan and Korea. I would also consider a reduction in Okinawa. There are scores of bases of varying sizes in Africa and Europe that should also be abandoned.