Quote:The government does things for the COLLECTIVE good - not for individual dead beat pissants who would rather buy a new gaming system than pay loans they are morally obligated to pay.

Stopping people from going into poverty IS A COLLECTIVE GOOD !!!!

(April 29, 2022 at 7:49 pm)Ranjr Wrote: "Moral" is for theists and philosophers.  If you want to play that card, question the morality of those who would tie down a kid with no financial experience.

I would argue that's abhorrent and immoral 

(April 29, 2022 at 3:39 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote:

(April 29, 2022 at 3:08 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: That's an evergreen question when it comes to the concerns of nuts.

I think it goes back to what Boru said in the OP: “Doing things that make your constituents lives better isn’t a bribe. It is - literally - your fucking job.” The more I look at politics, the more convinced I become that not only does the right (especially in America) reject that premise, but that rejection is the defining characteristic; everything else follows from that. If anything they do benefits anyone besides themselves, plutocrats, the police/military/anyone who makes their living with firearms, and maybe hate groups, it's almost certainly by accident.

Some people think everyone is an island and don't see the bigger picture 

(April 29, 2022 at 7:51 pm)Helios Wrote:

(April 29, 2022 at 3:39 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: I think it goes back to what Boru said in the OP: “Doing things that make your constituents lives better isn’t a bribe. It is - literally - your fucking job.” The more I look at politics, the more convinced I become that not only does the right (especially in America) reject that premise, but that rejection is the defining characteristic; everything else follows from that. If anything they do benefits anyone besides themselves, plutocrats, the police/military/anyone who makes their living with firearms, and maybe hate groups, it's almost certainly by accident.

Some people think everyone is an island and don't see the bigger picture 

And some people are, frankly, psychopaths. The sort of people who balk at ideas like loan forgiveness or people not having the right to force their children to breathe in toxic gases.

(April 29, 2022 at 7:55 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote:

(April 29, 2022 at 7:51 pm)Helios Wrote: Some people think everyone is an island and don't see the bigger picture 

And some people are, frankly, psychopaths. The sort of people who balk at ideas like loan forgiveness or people not having the right to force their children to breathe in toxic gases.

And some people are willing to get fucked by the system then treat it like it's some kind of virtue and complain that other people won't put up with the same.

(April 29, 2022 at 7:50 pm)Helios Wrote: I would argue that's abhorrent and immoral 

I owe my soul to the company store.

(April 29, 2022 at 8:07 pm)Ranjr Wrote:

(April 29, 2022 at 7:50 pm)Helios Wrote: I would argue that's abhorrent and immoral 

I owe my soul to the company store.

Not sure you can sell that 

(April 29, 2022 at 1:17 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Doing things that make your constituents lives better isn’t a bribe. It is - literally - your fucking job.

Boru

Hmmm well it does sound like a bribe—we'll give you money if you give us your vote. What meaningful difference is there between forgiving student loans and forgiving auto loans? The end result is financially the same for the individual: Less debt.

Unfortunately, I don't follow political debates enough to know what it all entails. But unless the reform is to make education free, and unless that change is implemented first, then what does forgiving student loans do besides buying votes?

And if your intent is to bribe, then at least offer auto and mortgage alternatives for those who don't have student debt. It'll make your constituents lives better all the same.

We can solve the current student debt crisis without proposing education reform at this time, And no that doesn't make it a bribe.