The gish gallup continues. True things are often unappealing. I truly ought to leave that second bowl of banana pudding in the fridge. Untrue things are often very appealing. Dr Quack says I can eat all the banana pudding I like.

Similarly, some people find their mortality and their moral responsibility very unappealing, and would prefer that they could escape the one and abdicate the other.

(June 16, 2023 at 12:27 am)Belacqua Wrote:

(June 16, 2023 at 12:09 am)Tomato Wrote: not enough coffee.

I'm often astonished at how much European civilization accomplished before they discovered coffee.

If I compared myself to how others achieved greatness, I would believe the lie that I am not great.

(June 16, 2023 at 12:03 am)Nishant Xavier Wrote: No one is saying, Christianity is True just because a majority of the population profess it.

This probably bears repeating, because I think some people may get the wrong message from the OP. 

The vast majority of people who have ever lived have had beliefs which we would categorize today as religious. This much seems undeniable. It is evidence of something. What we take it to point toward probably depends on our priors. Atheists who think that most people are more gullible than they are will take it as evidence of human gullibility. (I have seen such assertions on this forum.) 

Personally I think the fact that a handful of religions have attracted enormous percentages today shows that they plug into something very important in the human psyche. I am not (unlike some people on this forum) cynical enough to attribute the popularity entirely to brainwashing. 

I do believe there are truths in the human world which find powerful expression in religion. This doesn't mean that any one of them has the details right. It does mean that people may be very reasonable to join one or the other of them.

(June 16, 2023 at 12:36 am)Tomato Wrote:

(June 16, 2023 at 12:27 am)Belacqua Wrote: I'm often astonished at how much European civilization accomplished before they discovered coffee.

If I compared myself to how others achieved greatness, I would believe the lie that I am not great.

You think it's a lie to say you aren't great? You mean you think you're great? 

In what way?

If you conflate theism for religiousity, all sorts of silly shit might be true! That people are religious has absolutely no bearing on whether atheism is true or appealing - a significant number of those religious people are atheists themselves.

(June 16, 2023 at 12:01 am)Belacqua Wrote:

(June 15, 2023 at 11:26 pm)Tomato Wrote: Argumentum ad populum.

Just because a majority believes something to be true doesn't make it true. Atheism does not need to appeal to everyone, or a majority of the population, to be considered true.

Numbers aren't proof but they are often evidence.

Thats not how evidence works.

(June 15, 2023 at 11:18 pm)Nishant Xavier Wrote: If Atheism were allegedly a Universal Truth

You are trying to discuss Atheism, but you dont even know what Atheism is. Please do back to your drawing board. Go back home and do your basic homework, before you come back.

(June 15, 2023 at 11:18 pm)Nishant Xavier Wrote: Thoughts? Look forward to an intriguing discussion.

Lets be clear and honest: you are not
You are trying to preach, witness or troll this forum, or you would not put the most silly arguments that are out there on the table.

You are talking about objective moral values and dont know what that even is, you are talking about atheism and dont know what that is. You have "threatened" us to talk about design and you will demonstrate that you dont have a clue what you are talking about.

Go home, please.

(June 16, 2023 at 12:01 am)Belacqua Wrote:

(June 15, 2023 at 11:26 pm)Tomato Wrote: Argumentum ad populum.

Just because a majority believes something to be true doesn't make it true. Atheism does not need to appeal to everyone, or a majority of the population, to be considered true.

Numbers aren't proof but they are often evidence.

But evidence needs to be tested.  Ultimately all the numbers do is suggest "This appears to be a rather popular hypothesis.  Let's design an experiment to examine it in more detail."

(June 16, 2023 at 2:09 am)Astreja Wrote:

(June 16, 2023 at 12:01 am)Belacqua Wrote: Numbers aren't proof but they are often evidence.

But evidence needs to be tested.  Ultimately all the numbers do is suggest "This appears to be a rather popular hypothesis.  Let's design an experiment to examine it in more detail."

Yes, evidence points in a certain direction, but does not constitute proof. We should be skeptical of evidence to the degree it's warranted and test what can be tested.

(June 16, 2023 at 12:03 am)Nishant Xavier Wrote: When one chooses a leader democratically, why is the person who gets a Majority of votes the Winner? Because, one of the qualities a leader and his ideology must demonstrate is the ability to appeal to a significant majority of the population. No one is saying, Christianity is True just because a majority of the population profess it. There are other distinct arguments for the Truth of Christian Theism, like Messianic Prophecies that Jesus Christ fulfilled, and the Historical Evidence for His Resurrection, beside documented healing Miracles that have taken place in His Name, which is what has happened in Africa, for e.g.. Nonetheless, Atheism's inability to appeal to a significant population, especially a significantly diverse population, is telling.

If someone is at 33% in the polls, and another 3%, and even that limited small percentage within non-diverse demographics, everyone would logically assume the former had better appeal, and spoke to the deepest desires of the human heart, especially if that 33% was drawn from people of every caste, race, ethnicity, race, culture and language. It is not the sole deciding factor by any means, but it is still a noteworthy criterion. That 360 MN Christians prefer to be persecuted for Christ's Name rather than renounce Him, under Atheism, Islamism and Hindutva extremism, is also noteworthy.

God Bless.

(Bold mine)

You implied exactly that when you said:

Quote:So, the question: if Atheism were actually true, it would have Universal Appeal, and not be confined to certain limited cultures, but doesn't. Specifically, why are there so few Atheists in the Global South, in much of Africa (2%), in Latin America (4%), Middle East and North Africa (less than 1%) etc?

You conflated range of appeal with likelihood of truth with the implication that atheism is probably false because it appeals to fewer people. The obvious takeaway is that Christianity is probably true because it appeals to a great many people.

Furthermore, the bolded statement is factually incorrect. While Christianity is the largest single religion, it is untrue that 'a majority of the population profess it' - non-Christians outnumber Christians by 2 to 1.

Boru