(March 8, 2012 at 12:21 am)Voltair Wrote: Why you don't trust the Landover baptist people?

I am a landover baptist person.

Quote:Matthew uses Joseph's genealogy. Luke uses Mary's genealogy.

Bullshit. You aren't even a good apologist.

Quote:and Jacob the father of Joseph, the husband of Mary,

--Matthew 1:16

Joseph's genealogy.

Luke 3:23

Quote:23And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,

Joseph's genealogy AGAIN.


BTW, I shouldn't have to point this out to such a holy asshole as you but "Joseph" is not supposed to be the "father." He's the cuckold. God got in there ahead of him!

(March 8, 2012 at 12:29 am)YahwehIsTheWay Wrote: Tell me I'm wrong about what faith is. Faith is belief without reason or evidence. That's what Paul means when he says "conviction of things not seen".

You're right. That's exactly what faith is. But you still haven't told us, what's your wife's best pie and how many sons do you have?

Quote:These namby pamby Christians who look to apologetics are just trying to patch up their own pitifully weak faith.

I agree completely. It's pathetic.

Quote:I don't need evidence or logical reasons to believe so I have no need for apologetics. That is the power of faith!

It's so powerful. It makes me quiver in my heart to think of how powerful. Faith can move mountains. I mean, it never has before, but god says it can, so it must be The Truth. (Matthew 17:20)

Quote:People just say I and the good Christians at Landover Baptist are a POE but that's just because we believe ALL of the Bible. We don't pick and choose which parts we like and ignore the rest. Apologists are just trying to use logic to justify what isn't about logic.

Least hypocritical bunch I've ever had the pleasure of knowing.

Quote:Don't call me a POE. Tell me I'm wrong about what it means to believe the Bible and to have faith. Cite chapter and verse. You know I will.

I would, but I wouldn't want to displease Jesus. (1 Timothy 2:11-15)

(March 8, 2012 at 12:29 am)YahwehIsTheWay Wrote: Tell me I'm wrong about what faith is. Faith is belief without reason or evidence. That's what Paul means when he says "conviction of things not seen".

Faith is believing without seeing. As humans, it is impossible to believe without reason. Christians have reason, they just get it through places other than direct sensory intake--historical accounts, archeology, logic, morality, evidence of intelligent design. I can't see Alexander the Great before me right now, but I believe he existed. I can't scientifically test if my wife loves me, but I believe she does. Faith takes belief one step forward. Quoting C.S. Lewis: "Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason has once accepted in spite of your changing moods." I have faith my wife still loves me even after an argument, even when she is angry. Even when I am angry, I still love her back. That's faith.

secondary evidence-> reason -> belief -> faith

Historical accounts, archeology, logic, morality, evidence of intelligent design? Strange, I haven't seen any reason to believe in a god in any of that. Doesn't sound like faith to me either.

(March 8, 2012 at 12:44 am)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:23And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,

Joseph's genealogy AGAIN.

The parenthesis "(as was supposed)" is a reference to Jesus' virginal birth. This line is separate from the genealogy. Since Luke didn't consider Jesus Joseph's son at all, he used Mary's genealogy. Joseph is said to be the "son of Heli" because him being the legal father made the genealogy his as well. It was culturally normal to call the woman's genealogy her husband's too.

(March 8, 2012 at 12:53 am)Undeceived Wrote: Faith is believing without seeing. As humans, it is impossible to believe without reason.

We don't believe because of human reason. We believe because of the grace given to us by the Holy Spirit.

Quote:2Tim 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Quote:Christians have reason, they just get it through places other than direct sensory intake--historical accounts, archeology, logic, morality, evidence of intelligent design.

Paul was speaking metaphorically when he writes about things not seen. You see, this IS a good example of metaphor. He's not talking about the air or other things you can't see. He's using "not seen" to refer to what is not proven or has no evidence.

When you play this game, you are playing in the atheist's court. We as the saved do not believe because we are convinced by archaeology or any of that science stuff. We are saved by the grace of the Holy Spirit. Keep the discussion in the court where we have the advantage, in faith (and the torture chambers of the inquisitors but those damn liberals of the Enlightenment have taken all that away).

Quote:Quoting C.S. Lewis: "Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason has once accepted in spite of your changing moods." I have faith my wife still loves me even after an argument, even when she is angry. Even when I am angry, I still love her back. That's faith.

I'm looking for the Book of C.S. Lewis in the Bible but I can't find it. He's just an apologist, someone trying to use reason in matters of faith. I have no use for him.

Quote:secondary evidence-> reason -> belief -> faith

Uh, uh. Holy Spirit -> faith -> belief

(March 8, 2012 at 12:33 am)aleialoura Wrote:

(March 8, 2012 at 12:21 am)Voltair Wrote: Why you don't trust the Landover baptist people?

I am a landover baptist person.

............. Wanna make out?

Ummmm... A True Christian wouldn't do that.

So, yes.

(March 8, 2012 at 1:42 am)aleialoura Wrote: Ummmm... A True Christian wouldn't do that.

So, yes.

SCORE! Then can we go pig out at a buffet, and make out again? Then have a sword fight which may end in..... a wrestling match? Again these are only questions there is no obligation ... Although if the sword fight happens we must be wearing chain mail or heavier armor....