(June 18, 2012 at 5:37 pm)Thor Wrote: What a pantload! Your deity has never communicated with me in any way. And if he thinks he has communicated with me, he is mistaken. But how could that be when your god doesn't make mistakes? Could it be that he just doesn't exist at all?

If you are alive I can say that you have not asked sought or knocked as protrayed in Luke 11. That means if you have not received a measure of the Holy Spirit it is because you have not sought after God as perscribed.

Quote:WHAT sin? I just described a person who is selfless and does all he can to help others.

We are all with sin, no exceptions. Lust, anger, white lies, gossip, wanting more for yourself, Denying the existance of God.. All are with sin.

Quote: He just doesn't believe your deity is real. And that's enough to ship him off to fire camp for eternity?

Yes and rightfully so.

Quote:If your "sin" is mass murder I might agree with this statement.

your judgement of sin has no bearing on what sin is. All sin have been judged equally.
Sin is not 'morality' based righteousness where 'sin' is deemed as acts against humanity.
Sin is anything not in the expressed will of God.

Quote:The "sin" of simple disbelief? Absolutely ridiculous. But then, the idea of heaven and hell are equally ridiculous.

If a man says his only sin is disbelief, we can also add lying to his list.

Quote:And what of people who were born in a geographic region where they weren't exposed to your deity? Are they doomed for not believing in a god they never heard of?

They are judged on what they were exposed to.

(June 18, 2012 at 9:32 pm)Drich Wrote: If a man says his only sin is disbelief, we can also add lying to his list.

Lying is all you do here.


You missed your calling as a Westboro Baptist butt-boy.

(June 18, 2012 at 9:45 pm)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:

(June 18, 2012 at 9:32 pm)Drich Wrote: If a man says his only sin is disbelief, we can also add lying to his list.

Lying is all you do here.


You missed your calling as a Westboro Baptist butt-boy.

I missed many callings, being a westboro Baptist was one of them.

(June 18, 2012 at 9:32 pm)Drich Wrote:

(June 18, 2012 at 5:37 pm)Thor Wrote: What a pantload! Your deity has never communicated with me in any way. And if he thinks he has communicated with me, he is mistaken. But how could that be when your god doesn't make mistakes? Could it be that he just doesn't exist at all?

If you are alive I can say that you have not asked sought or knocked as protrayed in Luke 11. That means if you have not received a measure of the Holy Spirit it is because you have not sought after God as perscribed.

I assume you're talking about these verses: 9“So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. 10For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened."

I don't see anything specific in this verse regarding a precise exact formulaic way of asking God. At best all I see is just a general principle of prayer. And I don't see how it relates at all to nonbelievers getting proof of God's existence.

I can assure you that myself and probably many other atheists have specifically asked God in prayer for proof of his existence many times and got nothing

(June 18, 2012 at 10:00 pm)teaearlgreyhot Wrote:

(June 18, 2012 at 9:32 pm)Drich Wrote: If you are alive I can say that you have not asked sought or knocked as protrayed in Luke 11. That means if you have not received a measure of the Holy Spirit it is because you have not sought after God as perscribed.

I assume you're talking about these verses: 9“So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. 10For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened."

I don't see anything specific in this verse regarding a precise exact formulaic way of asking God. At best all I see is just a general principle of prayer. And I don't see how it relates at all to nonbelievers getting proof of God's existence.

I can assure you that myself and probably many other atheists have specifically asked God in prayer for proof of his existence many times and got nothing

Luke 11:5
9 “So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. 10 For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened.

(the next part is the promise)

11 “Which of you fathers, if your son asks for[f] a fish, will give him a snake instead? 12 Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? 13 If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!”

In the story of the persistent neighbor did the neighbor get what he wanted after the first attempt? No, The neighbor asked and kept asking/knocking till he got what He was looking for. Christ is saying if we ask for a measure of the Holy Spirit we will get what we persistently ask for.

Why do you want a measure of the holy Spirit? Because it is a Literal part of God who lives/becomes apart of you. If you want 'proof' of God Having Him be apart of you will be a large part of that 'proof.'

How do you know if yoou have a measure of the holy Spirit? There are Spiritual Fruit or rather there are physical manifestations of the Spirit of God being apart of you.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit that the Spirit produces in a person’s life is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, and self-control. There is no law against these kinds of things.

i know and paul knew that anyone could manifest these attributes, but the key to these signs of the indewellment of the Spirit is an overwhelming portion of these attributes.
Know that at first you might not even notice what you have been given. At first you might just see oppertunities to exhbit one of these attributes, and if you are faithful to the oppertunity you have been given you may be given another and another, till at some point you will develope a Spiritual Gift. Spiritual gifts are also found listed in scripture (one step at a time) They are often times based on one of the Spiritual fruits that you may be more inclined towards.

But before any of this will happen, most likly there are a few sins that you will feel weigh heavy on your heart. Before the Smallest measure of the Holy Spirit can be given to you must first repent of those sins. Not go to confession or Go before a congergation nor even to me. Just you and God, proclaim your desire to be seperated from the sin that owns you, so you and he can come together. ask that all obsticals/sin be taken down between you and mean it. Understand and don't feel bad if you can not seperate yourself from it completely (yet.) The Important thing is to have a contrite and repentant heart. Once you have done this I recomend unloading your bagage onto God ask Him why, then fill in the blank with every question you have and see what you can answer in your 'Seeking' as perscribed in luke 11. Reading the bible is going to have to be apart of this process, because God is identified in the bible. The only way to identify him in your life is to learn to look for Him in the scrpture. Then you will see what is written on page playout before you.

(June 18, 2012 at 3:52 pm)teaearlgreyhot Wrote:

(June 18, 2012 at 3:35 pm)Godschild Wrote: No one loves God until they meet Him in a personal relationship.

So I guess you don't love him then?

Oh yes very much.

(June 18, 2012 at 11:33 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(June 18, 2012 at 3:52 pm)teaearlgreyhot Wrote: So I guess you don't love him then?

Oh yes very much.

Only because you're terrified of what he'll do to you if you don't.

If am man said to you "Love me or I'll torture you for the rest of your life"

You'd call the cops on him.

But god says it and that's ok.

(June 18, 2012 at 9:51 pm)Drich Wrote:

(June 18, 2012 at 9:45 pm)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote: Lying is all you do here.


You missed your calling as a Westboro Baptist butt-boy.

I missed many callings, being a westboro Baptist was one of them.

I agree. You would fit right in.

(June 18, 2012 at 9:32 pm)Drich Wrote: If you are alive I can say that you have not asked sought or knocked as protrayed in Luke 11. That means if you have not received a measure of the Holy Spirit it is because you have not sought after God as perscribed.

Ah, yes... the old "You have never sought out God" bullshit. For the first 2+ decades of my life I was a believer. I prayed and sought out this deity you speak of. I NEVER received any sort of reply.

Quote:We are all with sin, no exceptions. Lust, anger, white lies, gossip, wanting more for yourself, Denying the existance of God.. All are with sin.

Anger is a "sin"? Gossip is a "sin"? Wanting more for yourself is a "sin"? Sounds like it's a sin to be human.

Quote: He just doesn't believe your deity is real. And that's enough to ship him off to fire camp for eternity?

Quote:Yes and rightfully so.

By your criteria, Gandhi is burning in hell. This is your idea of "rightfully so"?

Quote:your judgement of sin has no bearing on what sin is. All sin have been judged equally.
Sin is not 'morality' based righteousness where 'sin' is deemed as acts against humanity.
Sin is anything not in the expressed will of God.

Well, if all sin is judged equally, I might as well kill people I don't like as opposed to just gossiping about them., It's all the same, right?

Quote:If a man says his only sin is disbelief, we can also add lying to his list.

I would never say such a thing. Because the idea that disbelief in a deity constitutes "sin" is absolutely laughable.

Quote:They are judged on what they were exposed to.

Then if I was born into a civilization that prayed to volcanoes and practiced human sacrifice, I'd be okay because that's "what I was exposed to"?