You guys just don't get it. The economy is awful, oil prices are the highest they have ever been which mean gas, products, services all go up. People are stretched to the bone they don't need another TAX not now anyway. By all means fix health insurance problems just don't madate it people are worried aout paying their bills. The money i would have to pay for Obamacare is needed for my bills

Manowar

(July 28, 2012 at 6:28 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Did you see our olympic opening ceremony, 15 minutes devoted to celebrating the NHS.
Would the usa be so proud of its useless healthcare system that they seem to want to stay broken.
Obamacare isnt half way to creating a decent system but it was the nearset he was able to claw from the american idiots who vote against their interests.

In America, we do have a thing called "Medicare", which our conservatives want to reduce to being a coupon system for seniors to buy private health insurance (good luck finding a provider who will take you). The government is the single payer in this system. And guess what? It's the best and most efficient system of health care in America today by all measures, both in terms of patient satisfaction and in terms of cost of care.

It's amazing what happens when you remove useless middlemen like for profit health insurance companies who's financial interests run against providing health care.

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(July 28, 2012 at 10:22 am)Manowar Wrote: You guys just don't get it. The economy is awful, oil prices are the highest they have ever been which mean gas, products, services all go up. People are stretched to the bone they don't need another TAX not now anyway. By all means fix health insurance problems just don't madate it people are worried aout paying their bills. The money i would have to pay for Obamacare is needed for my bills

Manowar

I just got my gouging-refund from my private leeches (health insurance companies). My employees got one too. Because of the new reform law, health insurance companies can only make so much profit from their premiums. This is money in our pockets.

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(July 28, 2012 at 10:22 am)Manowar Wrote: The economy is awful

And who wrecked it again? Oh yeah, Republicans and their repeatedly failed policies of "trickle down" economics and "don't worry, markets will regulate themselves" deregulation. The former proved completely a waste of tax revenue as the rich simply hoarded their gains and the latter was an unmitigated disaster that plunged us into a depression.

Now they're promising more of the same if they win this year. How many times do you have to try something and have it fail before you realize it doesn't work?

(July 28, 2012 at 10:22 am)Manowar Wrote: You guys just don't get it. The economy is awful, oil prices are the highest they have ever been which mean gas, products, services all go up. People are stretched to the bone they don't need another TAX not now anyway. By all means fix health insurance problems just don't madate it people are worried aout paying their bills. The money i would have to pay for Obamacare is needed for my bills

Manowar

Oil prices have gone down, are continuing to go down, and will go further downhill until the 2013, according to economists and oil analysts. Haven't you noticed the Republicans have shut up about it? Not that the President can do anything to help oil prices, it's a world market, no matter what crap Newt 'for sale' Gingrich says. Increasing production with Keystone will do nothing for the price either. It's a drop in the ocean.



I will put one other point across about oil. The Koch brothers, Goldman Sachs and other speculators add around a 1/4 of the price:

Quote:If there were no speculation in oil futures on commodities exchange, the price of a barrel of oil might be as low as $74.61– not more than the present price of $108.00 a barrel.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertlenzne...er-barrel/

Oh, Manowar, a Republican president made speculation possible.

(July 28, 2012 at 10:28 am)DeistPaladin Wrote: And who wrecked it again? Oh yeah, Republicans and their repeatedly failed policies of "trickle down" economics and "don't worry, markets will regulate themselves" deregulation. The former proved completely a waste of tax revenue as the rich simply hoarded their gains and the latter was an unmitigated disaster that plunged us into a depression.

Now they're promising more of the same if they win this year. How many times do you have to try something and have it fail before you realize it doesn't work?

Oh Bullsh*t D! Barack Obama and the Democrats have done better? The national unemployment rate has remained above 8% ever since Obama's been in office (even though he promised to reduce the unemployment rate to below 6% at the end of his first term in office)....and the national debt is nearing $16 trillion. Candidate Obama also called Bush unpatriotic for adding nearly $5 trillion to the national debt in his eight years as president, but then President Obama adds $5 trillion to the national debt in just 3 1/2 years....and the left gives Obama a pass?! (I wonder if Obama will take credit for helping to build our debt?) It's more of the same hypocrisy and double standards from the left.

Edit: nevermind.

(July 28, 2012 at 10:07 am)Stue Denim Wrote: http://www.nhs.uk/Services/hospitals/Ove...px?id=1820
http://www.uclh.nhs.uk/OurServices/OurHo.../Home.aspx

Proud of that?

Proud of the health care system that has time and again helped with illness and injury. From the six months in traction my middle son received, to the fantastic care my mother had while she suffered from terminal cancer, all at zero cost at point of use, any one of those ailments would have caused me to be in debt till I died if I had been a in the US of A, but as this is britain and we have the wonderful NHS, I just pay my normal national insurnace and PAYE taxes and and happy to do it.
Americans pay the most and get the least because of the vested interests of big pharma. That they have managed to get people to accept this beggars belief and points out again how ill educated in the use of logic many americans seem to be.

You will need health care at some point.

There is simply no escaping it.

(July 28, 2012 at 11:17 am)A Theist Wrote: Oh Bullsh*t D! Barack Obama and the Democrats have done better?

A-Theist, I have one simple rhetorical question for you that will answer yours:

Would you trade the economy we have now for the one we had in Dec of 2008 when Bush wrapped up his disastrous administration?

I submit that "economic panic and collapse" < "sluggish recovery"

So yeah, Obama is a wimp and gave too much away to Republicans, which is why we didn't get the recovery package he wanted and we needed. Sorry your team's stonewalling has worked so well to keep unemployment high. Nonetheless, I wouldn't trade what we had then in 2008 for what we have now.

Quote:and the national debt is nearing $16 trillion. Candidate Obama also called Bush unpatriotic for adding nearly $5 trillion to the national debt in his eight years as president, but then President Obama adds $5 trillion to the national debt in just 3 1/2 years....and the left gives Obama a pass?! (I wonder if Obama will take credit for helping to build our debt?) It's more of the same hypocrisy and double standards from the left.

You want to know where the debt came from?

1. Bush tax cuts for the wealthy
2. The economic collapse caused by Republican deregulation
3. Bush's private war of aggression in Iraq which he lied us into
4. Bush's incompetently mismanaged war in Afghanistan.



See that tiny light blue sliver? It's the economic recovery spending measures that Teabaggers keep whining and wailing about? What do you want anyway? When your guy in office breaks everything, it costs money to fix it. Just leave the economy a broken mess? Oh, that would drive unemployment down.

Why can't you conservatives just admit you were wrong about everything? During the Bush fiasco, you got everything you wanted delivered to you on a silver platter with a side order of Democrat rollovers. Even after 2006, wimpy Palosi and super-wimp Ried continued to rubber stamp everything Bush stomped his foot and demanded. What are the results?

Aggressive tax cuts for the rich during wartime? You got it. The results: the worst job creation rate since the depression.

Deregulation? Hey, who needs Glass-Stiegal anyway? Oops, another economic meltdown. Who could have seen that coming?

Abstinence only sex ed? Sure thing! Now the teen pregnancy rate is up.

War in Iraq? OK, if you say so. Are you ready to admit that was a disaster?

How about global warming? Are you ready to admit that's real now?

Everything Republicans have tried, from economic policy to military adventures to the environment to social policy has been a disaster. The Bush misadministration now serves as a grand experiment. Behold the results! Can you name a single outcome that was beneficial?

Republican...
Policies...
Don't...
Work!

DP:

I don't disagree, but I'd go further.

Statist...
policies...
don't...
work!

and what's more they are immoral.

One note on deregulation though, let me ask this. There are different types of regulation, types that seek to control what company/industry X can and can't do, types that benefit company/industry X (e.g., like letting developers steal other's property, or the giving of subsidies/government backing) and then there are types that control what company/industry Y can do, which benefits company/industry X because now there is less/no competition. I ask you, if you think that it was deregulation to blame for the financial crisis, what type of deregulation was it? It certainly wasn't the scrapping of government subsidies and handouts. You moved closer to corportatism, the privatisation of profits and the socialisation of losses, it wasn't a free market.

plum: You're happy to pay for homeopathy hospitals (which is what I linked)? Alright then. Though I doubt I'll ever need that =P

Yes, I'll most likely need healthcare at some point (it's not 100%, If someone cuts me into pieces no amount of queen's horses and men will be able to put me back together again). That's not the point. It's socialised healthcare for adults (I'm totally ok with it for kids and for people who enter adulthood unable to earn a living due to illness*) that I wouldn't need.

*So long as it's sensible and necessary, see my previous links =P.

(July 28, 2012 at 10:22 am)Manowar Wrote: You guys just don't get it. The economy is awful, oil prices are the highest they have ever been which mean gas, products, services all go up. People are stretched to the bone they don't need another TAX not now anyway. By all means fix health insurance problems just don't madate it people are worried aout paying their bills. The money i would have to pay for Obamacare is needed for my bills

Manowar

How many times do I have to fucking say it? Do I need a drill?? So I can manually insert the idea into your head so you FINALLY will get it??

YOU AREN'T GOING TO BE PAYING SHIT. AT ALL. You STILL haven't posted any relevant information that shows you'll be paying $500 a month like you claimed!

You sound just like the rest of the religious twits who get onto this site with no knowledge of what they're talking about but make claims all over the place without ever backing them up. Congratulations, Manowar; you're officially theist-level stupid, now. I present to you this award:



Put it up on your mantle, for you truly put a lot of effort into this award! Be proud of your efforts!

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(July 27, 2012 at 7:33 pm)Manowar Wrote: Finally someone on my side!!!!!!!!

Manowar

CONGRATULATIONS! IT'S A RELIGIOUS GUY!

If there is one thing this site has taught me...ok, if there is one thing among the several, the one thing relevant right now, that this site has taught me, it's that if EVERYONE IS SAYING YOU ARE WRONG...if you pluck your fingers out of your ears and stop screaming "lalalalalala I can't hear you!!" and then you sit there and consider what they're saying to show why you're wrong, you're going to realize: GASP, SHOCK, you're wrong!

And when the religious people start AGREEING with you while the other atheists are going "NO you fucking idiot YOU'RE NOT RIGHT, FUCKING LISTEN!"? Duhhhhhhhhhrrrrrrrrrrrrr WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU THINK THAT MEANS?!

The Republican party still stick to the same "laissez faire" bullshit that helped the world get into one of the biggest financial crises in history, yet you still think they'll do a better job than the democrats. You really think the rich republicans care about your problems? They want the rich to remain rich and the poor to fuck off and get back to their underpaid job.