(July 26, 2012 at 12:25 am)Rhythm Wrote:

(July 25, 2012 at 9:55 pm)ElijahDrew Wrote: Libertarian. If you're human, you were born a fucking libertarian. I promise.

I'm afraid you're mistaken. Everyone who knew me then is clear on at least one issue, I was born a fascist.

I thought they were the same thing?

(July 19, 2012 at 10:59 pm)cratehorus Wrote: Anarchism, Fascism, Nationalism, Socialism, Communism, or a combination of 2, or more of these, or maybe something else entirely?

None of those apart from a democratic form of socialism. Because political utopiaism has lead to so many deaths (around 125 million in the 20th century according to the book The Black Book of Communism). Because often those who are Utopian when it comes to politics, have a mindset exactly the same as religious fanatics (like say those Al Qaeda terrorists).

Unsurprising, given that the religious mindset is the origin of our concept of utopia in the first place, and that all utopian fantasies invoked by this mindset ultimately rely on cosmic totalitarianism as a reinforcement to maintain it. When approached from this angle, I would be surprised if anyone was surprised that their political utopias didn't work out/devolved into violent despotism.

(July 19, 2012 at 10:59 pm)cratehorus Wrote: Anarchism, Fascism, Nationalism, Socialism, Communism, or a combination of 2, or more of these, or maybe something else entirely?

Star Trek.

Seriously, it seems to me that a form of a-nationalist, a-partisan, meritocratic, democratic, socio-liberal globalism which separates the administrative from the legislative. In the model I envision, an informed public would vote for the existence of roles and the individual role-holders so that 2 groups of 'leaders' are formed:

1. the people who 'know' best, who generate the legislation (the legislative)

2. the people who 'do' best, who put the legislation into practice (the administrative)

"from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" eh-

What could go wrong? hehehehe.

We already engage in that sort of system btw Ben, it's just that we have serious trouble determining who "knows best" and "does best"...lol. Figuring out a way to remedy that while retaining the democratic process (which is the source of that problem in the first place-albeit indirectly) appears to be a herculean task. Who informs the public, upon what should they be informed to make these decisions, and if they are well enough informed to decide these things, then who can be said to "know best" compared to the rest? And "does best" as in what, who can lift the heaviest bag? Organizing labor or effectively managing projects imho, is a skill, not an inborn talent. Anyone could fit this bill, once we invoke the "informed public".

(I loves me some Star Trek too, I have to mention that The United Federation of Planets is a mirror of UN/NATO, and the themes of the show are decidely Cold War-and we see how well that all worked out. Klingons being the red masses, borg -obviously in the newer runs- being the fear of the collective-the annihilation of personal and national identities taken too far. It's kind of amusing to see how the series changed over time)

(July 27, 2012 at 7:08 am)Justtristo Wrote: None of those apart from a democratic form of socialism.

again, what if the democracy doesn't desire socialism? What if the democracy desires theocracy?

Quote:Because often those who are Utopian when it comes to politics, have a mindset exactly the same as religious fanatics (like say those Al Qaeda terrorists).

Utopian socialists never actually used this name to describe themselves; the term "Utopian socialism" was introduced by Karl Marx

The answer is obvious! Anarcho-syndicalism.

Wasn't that easy now

(July 28, 2012 at 2:31 am)Violet Lilly Blossom Wrote: The answer is obvious! Anarcho-syndicalism.

Wasn't that easy now

Indeed.

Quote: There's a simple answer to everything,and it's wrong (Ambrose Bierce)

non of them,politics isnt worth anyone time,human race will die anyway

Just live your life make sure that you are nice to your close ones,and that you are having rich interesting life,and screw everyone else.

Oh IDK Hippie, all evidence points to the contrary, we're a stubborn little bunch of survivors.