(September 12, 2012 at 11:47 pm)TaraJo Wrote:

(September 12, 2012 at 11:25 pm)whateverist Wrote: So now there's a transdar?

Pretty much. You get familiar enough with trans folk and you learn to recognize us. It's a little eerie and I feel like an ass for reading people like that.

Quote: Honest to god I don't know why anyone would want to cut off their cock unless you just wanted to totally pass as female more than anything else. They are pretty handy things to have all in all. I wouldn't trust the doctors to put together a 'clitoris' that would work as well as the cock you have .. so why fuck with it?

Heh. You sound a little like Lee there.

Imagine if you had some strange growth coming out of your forehead. Sure, it might have uses here and there but it's going to feel weird and foreign and uncomfortable. That's how we feel. Plus, there's a big part of me that just knows my sex organs are supposed to be inside and having external genitals just feel 'off' for me.

Nature sometimes gets it wrong. No reason why we shouldn't see fit to correct it. People who call it "playing God" always make me laugh. Surely to play God you'd have to have no effect on the day to day workings of the world whatsoever. Of course they're actually referring to altering the natural order to produce "miracles" of science. "Miracles" supposedly being Gods thing.
Its a sentiment that screams "please don't do that, it makes my beliefs even more obsolete and useless.".
If it improves your life without harming others I see no reason why you shouldn't go for it.

(September 13, 2012 at 3:48 am)Puddleglum Wrote: I was particularly impressed with Greenknight 's advising against surgery. I am presuming he is a medically qualified Psychiatrist with several years experience dealing with transgendered issues.

Heh. We already have to deal with enough shrinks, thank you very much. When/if I get the surgery, one of the things doctors generally require is that we have a letter from a mental health professional or two that approves us for surgery and often also has to state how long we've been living as our desired gender (they usually want a minimum of one year, but there's been some flexibility to that lately).

And, yes, there are people who regret it for one reason or another, but they are in the vast minority.

And for the record, just a desire to 'be strong' isn't a good reason to not transition. I know some trans women who are damn strong. One is a personal trainer (although, in her case, she isn't as strong as she used to be since she was a body builder before). Anyway, I've always looked up to and respected psychological toughness far more than physical toughness anyway.

---

I suppose I should mention, I do kinda understand the 'don't do it' mindset. I've seen how Lee thinks of penises and if he had one, he wouldn't dream of getting rid of one. Penises are a big, important deal for guys, but the reason they're seen as important is part of why we generally don't want them: they're a big, obvious, symbol of masculinity.

(September 13, 2012 at 6:04 am)Puddleglum Wrote: I wouldn't even start to give out my 'tuppence worth' insuch a case. But then you are christian. telling people how to think must be second nature.

Yes, telling people what I think is second nature to me. I have told Christians (the superstitious variety) that God doesn't exist and they're furious with me. But I don't care. I will speak my mind.

(September 13, 2012 at 8:42 am)greneknight Wrote:

(September 13, 2012 at 6:04 am)Puddleglum Wrote: I wouldn't even start to give out my 'tuppence worth' insuch a case. But then you are christian. telling people how to think must be second nature.

Yes, telling people what I think is second nature to me. I have told Christians (the superstitious variety) that God doesn't exist and they're furious with me. But I don't care. I will speak my mind.

Hey, I hate to interrupt you two love birds but this is actually kind of an interesting subject and well when I look at the back and forth between you two I get alittle sleepy. I'd put it somewhere on par with watching Aliaster Darling compare carpet samples with Gordon Brown.
I suppose what I'm saying is... Grene, Puddle... get interesting or just stop typing. Seriously if you escalated it or something and made some mildly entertaining insults fair enough but this is like two tortoises competing in a staring contest for the last piece of lettuce.
If you two need to continue being boring thats fine. May I suggest the title of the new thread you two get separated into be called "The cure to insomnia? We think so!" or perhaps "How much dullness does it take to induce suicide? Lets find out!" or my personal favourite "The land that time didn't give a shit about."
Now I know, I know. Some of what I've said makes me seem like a cold, cruel and evil person... mostly because I am so thats how it comes across.
Shut the fuck up.

(September 13, 2012 at 9:37 am)RaphielDrake Wrote:

(September 13, 2012 at 8:42 am)greneknight Wrote: Yes, telling people what I think is second nature to me. I have told Christians (the superstitious variety) that God doesn't exist and they're furious with me. But I don't care. I will speak my mind.

Hey, I hate to interrupt you two love birds but this is actually kind of an interesting subject and well when I look at the back and forth between you two I get alittle sleepy. I'd put it somewhere on par with watching Aliaster Darling compare carpet samples with Gordon Brown.
I suppose what I'm saying is... Grene, Puddle... get interesting or just stop typing. Seriously if you escalated it or something and made some mildly entertaining insults fair enough but this is like two tortoises competing in a staring contest for the last piece of lettuce.
If you two need to continue being boring thats fine. May I suggest the title of the new thread you two get separated into be called "The cure to insomnia? We think so!" or perhaps "How much dullness does it take to induce suicide? Lets find out!" or my personal favourite "The land that time didn't give a shit about."
Now I know, I know. Some of what I've said makes me seem a cold, cruel and evil person... mostly because I am so thats how it comes across.
Shut the fuck up.

I didn't read what you wrote. Too wordy and way too boring. Say something exciting and I'll read it. You can't expect me to read tedious garbage, can you?

(September 13, 2012 at 9:40 am)greneknight Wrote: I didn't read what you wrote. Too wordy and way too boring. Say something exciting and I'll read it. You can't expect me to read tedious garbage, can you?

If you didn't read it, then how do you know that it was boring?

(September 13, 2012 at 9:40 am)greneknight Wrote:

(September 13, 2012 at 9:37 am)RaphielDrake Wrote: Hey, I hate to interrupt you two love birds but this is actually kind of an interesting subject and well when I look at the back and forth between you two I get alittle sleepy. I'd put it somewhere on par with watching Aliaster Darling compare carpet samples with Gordon Brown.
I suppose what I'm saying is... Grene, Puddle... get interesting or just stop typing. Seriously if you escalated it or something and made some mildly entertaining insults fair enough but this is like two tortoises competing in a staring contest for the last piece of lettuce.
If you two need to continue being boring thats fine. May I suggest the title of the new thread you two get separated into be called "The cure to insomnia? We think so!" or perhaps "How much dullness does it take to induce suicide? Lets find out!" or my personal favourite "The land that time didn't give a shit about."
Now I know, I know. Some of what I've said makes me seem a cold, cruel and evil person... mostly because I am so thats how it comes across.
Shut the fuck up.

I didn't read what you wrote. Too wordy and way too boring. Say something exciting and I'll read it. You can't expect me to read tedious garbage, can you?

Sure you didn't. Thats why you made a point of using boring in your retort.
Too wordy? Why am I not surprised to hear this? Could it be because someone who utilizes one dubious example to back up a rather inadequate point and then defend it from an obvious troll turning it into one of the worlds most unwarranted and uninteresting conversations ever held may lack the intellect to comprehend more than the words "Dinner time. :-)" and form the reply "Yay! Pudding!"? Let me stop you there, the answers yes.
Hate to break your flow but you could of taken that as an opportunity to stop pointlessly quibbling but now you've made it clear that this is infact what you want.
Well done. Please, by all means. Continue with your stupid, pointless, boring conversation that will inevitably write this thread off of anything remotely enjoyable or entertaining.

I think RaphielDrake is just upset because he was expecting 'racier' talk in a thread with 'buttsex' in its title.

(September 13, 2012 at 10:13 am)TaraJo Wrote: I think RaphielDrake is just upset because he was expecting 'racier' talk in a thread with 'buttsex' in its title.

Damn straight. You have any idea how much time it took to draw the curtains, scatter rose petals across the room, put Seal on my mp3, put my spandex superman outfit on, get lubed up and settle into a comfortable position with the PC at the ready?
That shit takes preparation. I had to clear a slot on my schedule for this. I could be spending quality time with my nephews right now. I mean I wouldn't because I'm a horrible uncle with a restraining order saying they can't come within 50 yards of me but the point still stands.

---

(September 13, 2012 at 8:35 am)TaraJo Wrote:

(September 13, 2012 at 3:48 am)Puddleglum Wrote: I was particularly impressed with Greenknight 's advising against surgery. I am presuming he is a medically qualified Psychiatrist with several years experience dealing with transgendered issues.

Heh. We already have to deal with enough shrinks, thank you very much. When/if I get the surgery, one of the things doctors generally require is that we have a letter from a mental health professional or two that approves us for surgery and often also has to state how long we've been living as our desired gender (they usually want a minimum of one year, but there's been some flexibility to that lately).

And, yes, there are people who regret it for one reason or another, but they are in the vast minority.

And for the record, just a desire to 'be strong' isn't a good reason to not transition. I know some trans women who are damn strong. One is a personal trainer (although, in her case, she isn't as strong as she used to be since she was a body builder before). Anyway, I've always looked up to and respected psychological toughness far more than physical toughness anyway.

---

I suppose I should mention, I do kinda understand the 'don't do it' mindset. I've seen how Lee thinks of penises and if he had one, he wouldn't dream of getting rid of one. Penises are a big, important deal for guys, but the reason they're seen as important is part of why we generally don't want them: they're a big, obvious, symbol of masculinity.

What are the physiological and psychological effects that you have observed in people who have taken the op? I mean aside from the obvious lack of certain extremities.
For example; does the lack of testosterone make them less physically strong over time? Do they find the way they approach certain situations to be radically different? Does their personality change in anyway, shape or form?
I mean there really is quite alot of questions surrounding it I don't know the answers to and I'd wager few people whos lives aren't directly effected by it do.

(September 13, 2012 at 9:48 am)RaphielDrake Wrote:

(September 13, 2012 at 9:40 am)greneknight Wrote: I didn't read what you wrote. Too wordy and way too boring. Say something exciting and I'll read it. You can't expect me to read tedious garbage, can you?

Sure you didn't. Thats why you made a point of using boring in your retort.
Too wordy? Why am I not surprised to hear this? Could it be because someone who utilizes one dubious example to back up a rather inadequate point and then defend it from an obvious troll turning it into one of the worlds most unwarranted and uninteresting conversations ever held may lack the intellect to comprehend more than the words "Dinner time. :-)" and form the reply "Yay! Pudding!"? Let me stop you there, the answers yes.
Hate to break your flow but you could of taken that as an opportunity to stop pointlessly quibbling but now you've made it clear that this is infact what you want.
Well done. Please, by all means. Continue with your stupid, pointless, boring conversation that will inevitably write this thread off of anything remotely enjoyable or entertaining.

If you want to sound intelligent and not stupid, you should write proper English. I've just scanned through what you wrote - sorry, I can't read so much garbage and quite a lot of it is incomprehensible. I think you need an English lesson. Let me offer you one.

1. You wrote "you could of taken that..." and I must say that's really ugly. "Of" for "have" is something you might see in a careless child's writing but it's not suitable for more mature folks like us.

2. "In fact" are two words. Writing them as one is something you ought not to do if the purport of your message is to attack someone's post. Writing intelligently is important when you are seeking to do that.

Let this be the guiding principle of your life, and all will be well.