(September 23, 2012 at 7:40 pm)Faith No More Wrote:

(September 23, 2012 at 7:39 pm)Darkstar Wrote: It goes against everything America is supposed to stand for.

Supposed to, yes, but in reality, after 9/11 America seemed to stand for revenge at any price.

And paranoia; otherwise, we wouldn't have TSA grope fests/peep shows every time we try to get on an airplane. I should charge them $3.99 a minute just like everyone else has to pay.

(September 23, 2012 at 7:28 pm)Annik Wrote: What actions? Did you even read the article?

The article is from Aljazeera so I don't consider it to be giving an unbiased account of his situation. They claim he was picked up by bounty hunters. Other news outlets reported that he was picked up by Pakistani police for ties to Al Queda. The actions I refer to are whatever led to the police or our military to be suspicious of him. I don't know what those were specifically.

(September 23, 2012 at 8:06 pm)Tino Wrote:

(September 23, 2012 at 7:28 pm)Annik Wrote: What actions? Did you even read the article?

The article is from Aljazeera so I don't consider it to be giving an unbiased account of his situation. They claim he was picked up by bounty hunters. Other news outlets reported that he was picked up by Pakistani police for ties to Al Queda. The actions I refer to are whatever led to the police or our military to be suspicious of him. I don't know what those were specifically.

Uh, what? Al Jazeera is one of the best news outlets. It's consistently a step ahead of other sources, and provides relatively unbiased information in the midst of so much bullshit. They remain impartial even with pressure from other governments on them.

Are you even serious right now?

(September 23, 2012 at 7:14 pm)Hovik Wrote: and died never having committed terrorism.

Making absolutely no statement on him being held or the veracity of his detainment, I have to mention one thing. You cannot say with any certainty that the above statement is true. I completely understand being upset about him being charged, but assuming that he never committed an act of terrorism when all you know about his life was that he was imprisoned without charges is a fucking stretch. He could be as innocent as a baby, but you're definitely making a claim without evidence. No charge =/= to innocent.

(September 23, 2012 at 8:06 pm)Tino Wrote:

(September 23, 2012 at 7:28 pm)Annik Wrote: What actions? Did you even read the article?

The article is from Aljazeera so I don't consider it to be giving an unbiased account of his situation. They claim he was picked up by bounty hunters. Other news outlets reported that he was picked up by Pakistani police for ties to Al Queda. The actions I refer to are whatever led to the police or our military to be suspicious of him. I don't know what those were specifically.

Police and military make mistakes, even if the source wasn't dubious.
Fact is they torture people in there. Literally. Kind of feels hypocritical to accuse the enemy of cruelty and brutality when we do the same in areas like Guantanmo Bay we deem sanctioned for the act with next to no regard to evidence and judicial process.

(September 23, 2012 at 7:39 pm)Darkstar Wrote: I'm pretty sure that they violated most of his constitutional rights

He doesn't really have Constitutional rights. That's the kicker about GB.

(September 23, 2012 at 7:53 pm)RaphielDrake Wrote: er.... Tino. Not to contradict you but I think you'll find he wasn't actually charged with anything. He was picked up by bounty hunters claiming he was a terrorist who since have shown signs of being corrupt and picking up random guys to turn them in for a quick buck.

Raphiel, I don't see the bounty hunter story coming from any source other than AlJazeera. The NY Times, only a sliver to the right of AlJazeera, doesn't make that claim, but instead attributes his pickup to Pakistani police.

I agree that this is a shitty situation, but so is terroristic warfare. In prior wars the detainees would have been shot as spies for being out of uniform. In this war only the US wears a uniform, which puts the local population at risk of this type of harm. It's an impossible situation, and I don't blame the US for not being able to handle it to perfection.

(September 23, 2012 at 8:13 pm)Tino Wrote:

(September 23, 2012 at 7:53 pm)RaphielDrake Wrote: er.... Tino. Not to contradict you but I think you'll find he wasn't actually charged with anything. He was picked up by bounty hunters claiming he was a terrorist who since have shown signs of being corrupt and picking up random guys to turn them in for a quick buck.

Raphiel, I don't see the bounty hunter story coming from any source other than AlJazeera. The NY Times, only a sliver to the right of AlJazeera, doesn't make that claim, but instead attributes his pickup to Pakistani police.

I agree that this is a shitty situation, but so is terroristic warfare. In prior wars the detainees would have been shot as spies for being out of uniform. In this war only the US wears a uniform, which puts the local population at risk of this type of harm. It's an impossible situation, and I don't blame the US for not being able to handle it to perfection.

Tino, we know for a fact mercs and bounty hunters have been used by our side. Now... could you point out a news story from a western source that mentions them once? Because I'd seriously have trouble doing that.

(September 23, 2012 at 8:11 pm)Shell B Wrote:

(September 23, 2012 at 7:14 pm)Hovik Wrote: and died never having committed terrorism.

Making absolutely no statement on him being held or the veracity of his detainment, I have to mention one thing. You cannot say with any certainty that the above statement is true. I completely understand being upset about him being charged, but assuming that he never committed an act of terrorism when all you know about his life was that he was imprisoned without charges is a fucking stretch. He could be as innocent as a baby, but you're definitely making a claim without evidence. No charge =/= to innocent.

He was proven not to be implicated in any sort of terrorist activity. His release was demanded by the Supreme Court. He was never charged with a crime.

And at any rate, we've been through this before. His innocence should have been presumed in the light of zero evidence to the contrary until evidence could be brought forth that demonstrated his guilt.

(September 23, 2012 at 8:11 pm)Hovik Wrote: Are you even serious right now?

You know, I like to discuss things, and I generally try to keep it civil, but when some fuckhead asks me if I'm serious, then I have to call him out in public, and ask if said fuckhead even bothered to read the fucking article he posted himself, which ends with:

"The views expressed in this article are the author's own and do not necessarily reflect Al Jazeera's editorial policy."

So fuck you, yes I'm serious, and kiss my ass.

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(September 23, 2012 at 8:14 pm)RaphielDrake Wrote: Tino, we know for a fact mercs and bounty hunters have been used by our side. Now... could you point out a news story from a western source that mentions them once? Because I'd seriously have trouble doing that.

I don't deny that we could or do use them. But I don't see a reliable news source claiming that that was how this guy was picked up. I just see some writer that even Aljazeera doesn't vouch for.