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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 4:13 pm
(This post was last modified: November 12, 2012 at 4:14 pm by Darkstar.)
W-what...? We know pineapples exist, we know the world trade centers were attacked on 9/11. They have already been proven. The problem for you is, we can prove that pineapples exist, but not so for god...or the other examples. The burden of proof is on the one making the original claim. If one rejects said claim, then the claim must be proven. That's it.
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 4:21 pm
(This post was last modified: November 12, 2012 at 4:26 pm by Ryantology.)
(November 12, 2012 at 4:06 pm)Undeceived Wrote: http://bbhchurchconnection.wordpress.com...-of-proof/
As always, the theist gets it wrong. It is not simply that the claim of theists is positive rather than negative, or even mostly that. It is that the claim of theists is supported by no evidence. The burden on the atheist is to respond to the evidence of theists. As the theist has no evidence on display, we are satisfying our burden.
There is copious evidence of the existence of Washington, Churchill, etc. from multiple and independent sources. Denying their existence involves the same ignorance of evidence driving the theist to insist God exists. So, the theist hides behind unfalsifiable claims and pretends that is the intellectual equivalent of evidence.
You do not get to claim a victory in a debate because you do not understand the basics of how logic works.
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 4:34 pm
(This post was last modified: November 12, 2012 at 4:41 pm by Undeceived.)
(November 12, 2012 at 4:21 pm)Ryantology Wrote: (November 12, 2012 at 4:06 pm)Undeceived Wrote: http://bbhchurchconnection.wordpress.com...-of-proof/
As always, the theist gets it wrong. It is not simply that the claim of theists is positive rather than negative, or even mostly that. It is that the claim of theists is supported by no evidence.
There is copious evidence of the existence of Washington, Churchill, etc. from multiple and independent sources. Denying their existence involves the same ignorance of evidence driving the theist to insist God exists.
Thanks for playing, though. There are 27 New Testament books and 66 in the whole Bible, many of which make predictions that came true. Outside sources:
http://www.evidencetobelieve.net/history_of_jesus.htm
http://www.probe.org/site/c.fdKEIMNsEoG/...ources.htm
Are you saying all this evidence is a cleverly-contrived pack of lies? Well then, I declare all mentions of George Washington to be part of a conspiracy, perhaps devised by John Adams (the real first president) to pretend that a much more likeable man was president instead. The motive or the who makes no difference. George Washington was not president until you prove it with evidence I, the skeptic, accept as evidence. You have the burden of proof, my friend. George Washington was not a real man.
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 5:04 pm
(November 12, 2012 at 3:15 pm)Darkstar Wrote: Actually, I never said there was battlefield rape. You said they were kidnapped and forcibly married to their conquerers. I agree with that. After which, of course, they were expected to submit to them sexually, so yeah, they got raped after the battle. It wasn't defined as rape at the time, but it would be now. Now the treatment would depend on where you are. Many arranged marriages throughout history (including today) and across cultures would be considered rape by certain jurisdictions today.
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 5:08 pm
(November 12, 2012 at 5:04 pm)John V Wrote: Now the treatment would depend on where you are. Many arranged marriages throughout history (including today) and across cultures would be considered rape by certain jurisdictions today.
Rape = sex without consent
Those girls couldn't say no, so it was rape. Yeah, there have been arranged marriages past the middle ages in which a husband could force his wife to have sex with him. Does that make it okay? And to top it all off, they (the conquered) would already be dealing with the emotional trauma of having their whole family slaughtered, only to be forcibly married to, and raped by, someone who had a part in the killings. That's pretty sick...
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 5:12 pm
(November 12, 2012 at 5:08 pm)Darkstar Wrote: Rape = sex without consent
Those girls couldn't say no, so it was rape. Yeah, there have been arranged marriages past the middle ages in which a husband could force his wife to have sex with him. Does that make it okay? It makes it something other than rape. I agree that the freedom of choice available in the west today makes this seem strange, but I also recognize that this freedom is somewhat of a rarity.
The U.K. passed a law against forced marriage in 2007, so it seems to be spreading.
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 5:22 pm
(November 12, 2012 at 5:12 pm)John V Wrote: It makes it something other than rape. I agree that the freedom of choice available in the west today makes this seem strange, but I also recognize that this freedom is somewhat of a rarity.
The U.K. passed a law against forced marriage in 2007, so it seems to be spreading.
Forced marriage does not necessarily equate to rape. It is when the wife (it could also technically be the husband, but I don't think it ever has been) is forced to have sex. Marriage is not rape, rape is rape, regardless of context.
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 6:13 pm
(November 12, 2012 at 4:34 pm)Undeceived Wrote: There are 27 New Testament books and 66 in the whole Bible, many of which make predictions that came true. Outside sources:
http://www.evidencetobelieve.net/history_of_jesus.htm
http://www.probe.org/site/c.fdKEIMNsEoG/...ources.htm
Are you saying all this evidence is a cleverly-contrived pack of lies? Well then, I declare all mentions of George Washington to be part of a conspiracy, perhaps devised by John Adams (the real first president) to pretend that a much more likeable man was president instead. The motive or the who makes no difference. George Washington was not president until you prove it with evidence I, the skeptic, accept as evidence. You have the burden of proof, my friend. George Washington was not a real man.
These sources deal with the existence of Jesus (a possibility I am willing to accept). Neither prove that Jesus was what he said he was. Neither prove the existence of God.
Also, it's well-known that the New Testament was written after the events it purports to describe, which would make its predictive qualities nonexistent. There is no evidence that the Bible definitely predicted any event, and even if it did, the likely explanation is that the predictions were added long after the events they purport to predict.
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 8:18 pm
(This post was last modified: November 12, 2012 at 8:18 pm by Lion IRC.)
(November 12, 2012 at 6:13 pm)Ryantology Wrote: ...Also, it's well-known that the New Testament was written after the events it purports to describe, which would make its predictive qualities nonexistent.
There are many bible prophecies written centuries before the actual event. The problem is when people say, oh well Jesus is just doing those things in order to make it look like as if He is the fulfilment of the prophecy.
Thats a pretty lame argument because it makes it impossible for ANYONE to fulfil the prophecy. If they dont ride a donkey into Jerusalem they are excluded and if they DO they are still excluded.
Then, to top it all off, you go to write about someone riding a donkey into Jerusalem and people get on your case because you're writing about it after it happened.
Is it OK for newspapers supposed to be printed AFTER the events they report happened?
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RE: Christians celebrate rape, torture, slavery and genocide.
November 12, 2012 at 8:35 pm
(This post was last modified: November 12, 2012 at 8:37 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 12, 2012 at 8:18 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: There are many bible prophecies written centuries before the actual event.
Well break out the motherfucking bubbly eh? We got some real life fortune tellers on our hands! On second thought, don't, because your peddling garbage. I love how you go off on a tangent, as though there is someone in your mind having an entirely separate conversation that you are gracing us with.
The problem.....is that prophecy is rank bullshit, not that some godman was trying to trick people..ffs....
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