(November 15, 2012 at 6:02 am)Darnem Wrote: Why do you push your religion of Atheism on others when there is no evidence that God doesn't exist?

(November 23, 2012 at 8:48 am)Zen Badger Wrote: Same thing really.

Nothing to add on gay marriage?

He has been trying really hard to avoid that question. Its amazing how he writes words to answer a question without actually answering the question.

(November 23, 2012 at 8:59 am)Waratah Wrote: He has been trying really hard to avoid that question. Its amazing how he writes words to answer a question without actually answering the question.

Think I should get into politics?

(November 23, 2012 at 9:03 am)Darnem Wrote:

(November 23, 2012 at 8:59 am)Waratah Wrote: He has been trying really hard to avoid that question. Its amazing how he writes words to answer a question without actually answering the question.

Think I should get into politics?

The republican party would fuckken love you.

(November 23, 2012 at 9:03 am)Darnem Wrote:

(November 23, 2012 at 8:59 am)Waratah Wrote: He has been trying really hard to avoid that question. Its amazing how he writes words to answer a question without actually answering the question.

Think I should get into politics?

That's still not answering the question.

Forget it Darnem...you'd never make it in politics...... you are far too obvious.

(November 23, 2012 at 8:02 am)Daniel Wrote:

(November 22, 2012 at 1:53 pm)Stimbo Wrote: At the risk of being a stirrer, I'd like to ask what you believe our "world view" to be?

Because you group all us Christians together and assume we have the same world view, you've now assumed you have the same world view as KichigaiNeko! I could have just as easily asked what mine was supposed to be, but supposedly it's "hate, greed, intolerance and supremacy"

But what actually is it? I don't care if I share whatever-it-is with another person, most especially Kichi for whom I have a great deal of respect. I also didn't ask what you think I/we consider your own world-view to be, nor do I particularly care. You've placed yourself squarely behind your magic book and that's good enough for me. The thing is, whenever a person of strong opinion is pressed for details on those opinions, in other words dragged from the general to the specific, all their previous certainty tends to melt away like snow on a sunny day.

I await your next shipment of red herrings. Invoice enclosed.

Quote:Because you group all us Christians together and assume we have the same world view, you've now assumed you have the same world view as KichigaiNeko! I could have just as easily asked what mine was supposed to be, but supposedly it's "hate, greed, intolerance and supremacy"

I think you may have misunderstood the aim of the thread. We know that most people who call themselves Christians do not celebrate "hate, greed, intolerance and supremacy". Most people do not celebrate "hate, greed, intolerance and supremacy".

However, you claim to worship a divinity that according to your holy book committed multiple acts of intolerance and supremacy. There is a contradiction between whatdifferent claims you make, like "God is the ultimate source of morality, and what is written in the Bible shows it" and "we're a religion of peace and love", and coming up with several creative interpretations ("God changed his mind" etc. ) does not help.

This wouldn't be a problem if you simply rejected the Bible as a source of morality, or claimed that what is written on the Bible is not actually word of your god. Many self-professed Christians do that.

The apologists and the fundamentalists, however, have no choice but celebrate "hate, greed, intolerance and supremacy". Drich, for example, does exactly that: he claims that (paraphrasing Richard Nixon) "when God does it that means it is not immoral".

Do you believe that genocide is moral when your god does it, Daniel? And if you don't, can you still claim the Bible is the source of your morality?

The trouble with any christian sect isn't in the claiming. They're all clearly capable of claiming an number of ridiculous thing. The trouble is substantiating those claims. So when you ask someone "can you claim" etc...who fucking cares, of course they can claim it, whatever it is....but can they substantiate that claim?

(November 23, 2012 at 8:48 am)Zen Badger Wrote: Same thing really.

Nothing to add on gay marriage?

I thought I already made my opinion perfectly clear?

Howabout I explain again, for all those less fortunate individuals who somehow missed it.

The whole world lives in sin (obviously), we know this is true because Jesus tells us so: Mark 2:17: 'And when Jesus heard it, he said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I came not to call the righteous, but sinners.”'

That's a pretty universal concept understood by every Christian, and most of the remainder of the western world too. I have unwed friends that live as couples, who doesn't? They're living in sin. Homosexual relationships are the same thing.

But, you tell me, they're perfectly natural. True, and as the Jesus clearly says (John 3:6) 'Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.' Paul explains this further (Galatians 5:17) 'For the desires of the flesh are against the Spirit, and the desires of the Spirit are against the flesh, for these are opposed to each other, to keep you from doing the things you want to do.'

Can we expect non-Christians not to live in sin? Absurd. So of course, you don't see a problem. You'd only see it as a problem if you converted the Christianity and realized that sin is condemned.

Of course we should be inwardly focused. For instance, I find it disturbing that so many of us are overweight. Maybe put it down to an oversight, but the reality is that many people don't want to acknowledge their own sinful lifestyle. A lifestyle which leads us to be fat is clearly sinful. God destroyed Sodom because the people were fat and lazy, proud and inhospitable:

Ezekiel 16:49-50: 'Behold, this was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had pride, excess of food, and prosperous ease, but did not aid the poor and needy. They were haughty and did an abomination before me. So I removed them, when I saw it.'

So I'm far more concerned about the health of the Church and the Christians, than to concern myself overly with the ways of the world.

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(November 23, 2012 at 12:31 pm)Stimbo Wrote: The thing is, whenever a person of strong opinion is pressed for details on those opinions, in other words dragged from the general to the specific, all their previous certainty tends to melt away like snow on a sunny day.

Some things are certain and some things are not. Get past it.

(November 24, 2012 at 10:10 am)Daniel Wrote:

(November 23, 2012 at 8:48 am)Zen Badger Wrote: Same thing really.

Nothing to add on gay marriage?

So I'm far more concerned about the health of the Church and the Christians, than to concern myself overly with the ways of the world.

As well you might be mate. It always seems to be those who try so hard to deny their nature that wind up doing the perp walk in the news. (I'm thinking here of the sleazy teleministers like Jimmy Swaggart and the family values conservative republicans such as Larry 'Widestance' Craig we have here in the states, but I'm sure you have to worry about yours down under as well.)

I did recently come across still another excellent argument in favor of gay marriage for those still undecided. Have you considered the repercussions of the case made in this video, Daniel?

http://youtu.be/X-YCdcnf_P8