(January 7, 2013 at 6:39 am)Zen Badger Wrote:

(January 6, 2013 at 10:22 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: Theres no ''hole'' in God's gracious forgiveness of repentant sinners.

The convo goes like this...

Matt - it's wrong to sin.
Larry - I know
Matt - did you sin?
Larry - yep.
Matt - then you're going to hell.
Larry - yes but....''“If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.” 1 John 1:9

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Sin is not a terminal illness. Eternal life is available to anyone who wants it. John 3:16

Yep, you can steal and lie and fornicate and be a general arsehole all you r life, but just say you're sorry at the end and booya! you're in heaven.

I like that cartoon Zen Badger.

2 sinners. Both in heaven. What does that tell you?

Both repentant and both graciously forgiven for their past crimes.

Q. How did you get into heaven?
A. The same way you did.

(January 7, 2013 at 9:16 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: I like that cartoon Zen Badger.

2 sinners. Both in heaven. What does that tell you?

Both repentant and both graciously forgiven for their past crimes.

Q. How did you get into heaven?
A. The same way you did.

So theoretically Hitler can go to heaven as well right?

Your religion is so fucked up.

Theres no ''hole'' in God's gracious forgiveness of repentant sinners.



Sure there is -" god "has committed MANY sins (As defined supposedly by himself) and has no one to go to for forgiveness so it cannot be "saved"

(January 7, 2013 at 10:20 pm)ThomM Wrote: Theres no ''hole'' in God's gracious forgiveness of repentant sinners.



Sure there is -" god "has committed MANY sins (As defined supposedly by himself) and has no one to go to for forgiveness so it cannot be "saved"

The "hole" started after Jesus's death. And "Jesus died for our sins" so we now were saved by "grace". We don't repent all of our sins. All men fall short. All men separate themselves from God by sin. But then God "saves" them by "grace".

How many unrepented sins can you commit and still be saved by grace? How do you know if your sins are being forgiven. If you steal but don't repay the person that you stole from, are you truly repentant? And if you are not truly repentant, is your sin truly forgiven? Are you still separated from God? If God "saves" you in the end by "grace" -- then do you have to truly repent for any of your sins?

Hey Lion, I'm still waiting for you to justify this concept of justice you think is so logical.

How is justice served when an innocent person takes on the consequences of the criminal's actions?

How is justice served when an innocent person [willingly] takes on the consequences of the criminal's actions?

What's it got to do with you?

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I'm not saying that to dismiss the question. I want you to think carefully about it.
If it doesnt affect you, no injustice is done to you.
If the grateful, humbled, and forgiven criminal learns a valuable lesson and is redeemed/rehabilitated, no injustice is done to you.
And if the crime has already been done you cant change an injustice that happened in the past. Just learn from it for a better future.

(January 8, 2013 at 2:01 am)Lion IRC Wrote: How is justice served when an innocent person [willingly] takes on the consequences of the criminal's actions?

What's it got to do with you?

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I'm not saying that to dismiss the question. I want you to think carefully about it.
If it doesnt affect you, no injustice is done to you.
If the grateful, humbled, and forgiven criminal learns a valuable lesson and is redeemed/rehabilitated, no injustice is done to you.
And if the crime has already been done you cant change an injustice that happened in the past. Just learn from it for a better future.

Why don't we have innocent people lining up to go to jail in place of the criminals in this day and age? Clearly justice doesn't work like that. The offender must serve their sentence for justice to be done.

(January 8, 2013 at 2:28 am)FallentoReason Wrote:

(January 8, 2013 at 2:01 am)Lion IRC Wrote: How is justice served when an innocent person [willingly] takes on the consequences of the criminal's actions?

What's it got to do with you?

---

I'm not saying that to dismiss the question. I want you to think carefully about it.
If it doesnt affect you, no injustice is done to you.
If the grateful, humbled, and forgiven criminal learns a valuable lesson and is redeemed/rehabilitated, no injustice is done to you.
And if the crime has already been done you cant change an injustice that happened in the past. Just learn from it for a better future.

Why don't we have innocent people lining up to go to jail in place of the criminals in this day and age? Clearly justice doesn't work like that. The offender must serve their sentence for justice to be done.

Of course the Christians might argue that the woman who had been raped had never "accepted" Jesus. Therefore she went to hell after being raped and murdered. And the rapist confessed his sins at the last second -- and went to heaven..

Yeah. Also, when did dead-born baby's sin?

(January 8, 2013 at 8:58 am)Dee Dee Ramone Wrote: Yeah. Also, when did dead-born baby's sin?

Just existing is a sin to them.