(February 18, 2014 at 10:58 am)Jacob(smooth) Wrote: To take the matter at hand, the "people evolved from monkeys" thing. That's a nonsense spread by the uneducated to ridicule a model they don't understand. I'd like to see people question that. However if the explanation is pre or suffixed by "you fucking moron" (or variation) the explanation is more likely to be shrugged off as Atheists being hateful.

That's actually why I started out more "disappointed, but attempting to be reasonable," this time around; though the conduct is shameful, one has to allow for the possibility that this person just hasn't ever been exposed to correct information about evolution before. So I tried pointing out how continuing to use misrepresentations is lying by omission, and I linked to some references the guy could use to learn first.

He has, clearly, not done so, and has in fact repeated the same incorrect assertions again. I still corrected him, but we're now beyond the point where we can use honest ignorance as an excuse, and I don't think lies need to be treated gently.

(February 18, 2014 at 1:11 pm)Esquilax Wrote:

(February 18, 2014 at 10:58 am)Jacob(smooth) Wrote: To take the matter at hand, the "people evolved from monkeys" thing. That's a nonsense spread by the uneducated to ridicule a model they don't understand. I'd like to see people question that. However if the explanation is pre or suffixed by "you fucking moron" (or variation) the explanation is more likely to be shrugged off as Atheists being hateful.

That's actually why I started out more "disappointed, but attempting to be reasonable," this time around; though the conduct is shameful, one has to allow for the possibility that this person just hasn't ever been exposed to correct information about evolution before. So I tried pointing out how continuing to use misrepresentations is lying by omission, and I linked to some references the guy could use to learn first.

He has, clearly, not done so, and has in fact repeated the same incorrect assertions again. I still corrected him, but we're now beyond the point where we can use honest ignorance as an excuse, and I don't think lies need to be treated gently.

Especially in instances where it's perfectly clear the poster will multi-quote and respond to every point except the correction, and conclude "so as you can see, your claim we evolved from monkeys is wrong".

They didn't read the objection, they're not interested in any. Their mind is already made up.

(February 18, 2014 at 9:42 am)Revelation777 Wrote:

(February 17, 2014 at 11:13 pm)Cinjin Wrote: You have no idea how long it would take to teach a dullard such as yourself the myriad of principles behind evolution.
Read for yourself you dolt.
Some More
And More.


And?
That buffoon, Ron L. Hubbard writes a lot of fiction too and claims that its fact. Who gives a shit what a bunch of ancient goat herders wrote?

Why do most atheist resort to insults instead of respectful discussion?
Jesus warned that there will be many false Christ that would appear. There is only one truth, that coming from Jesus, the Son of God.

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(February 18, 2014 at 9:33 am)Esquilax Wrote: Given that only god knows who's a true christian and who isn't, it's not up to you to make those distinctions.

Actually you are right! I can't judge who is a real believer or not. However, I know that there are those out there that claim to be Christian who are not based on that verse. The greatest clue we get of a true believer is by the fruit they produce in their lives.

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(February 18, 2014 at 5:52 am)Esquilax Wrote: What they're getting is a big heaping helping of self righteousness, at the expense of looking down on us poor pitiful atheists. I, for one, don't appreciate being sneered at like I've never heard of the damn bible before, and I similarly don't like being threatened and cajoled with the possibility of hell.

Moreover, I dislike being lied to, and what else would you call this kind of retained ignorance in the face of requests to educate oneself, especially given that we've generally already done the wiki walking to link them right to the information?

You're right, they probably don't intend any harm, and even think they're doing a good thing, but I'm not going to be so condescending as to treat that ignorance with the kiddie gloves just because it's sincere.

At first we offered guidance. They refused to take it; what happens now is solely down to a refusal to even listen to a competing point of view.

I don't feel self righteous. In fact I understand that I am a sinner and there is nothing righteous about me outside of Christ. I need a Savior, I need to be saved, I was lost.

You still are mate

(February 18, 2014 at 11:00 am)fr0d0 Wrote: Those Christian forums have the better idea. Just block and ban rather than insult etc. To atheist forums it seems a major part of why they exist. Either that or people genuinely believe there's the chance someone will pop up with the answer.

Maybe it seems that way in practise, however in principle the raison d'être for this forum, at least, is outlined in the rules:

Quote:The Purpose of Atheist Forums

These forums were created for the purpose of providing friendly discussion and debate between atheists and other like-minded individuals, as well as theists. Theists are more than welcome to join and enter into discussion but please bear in mind the nature of this community and take a few moments to read the 'Important Information for Theists' thread before contributing.

We believe in freedom of speech / expression, which means you can discuss your ideas without fear of censorship or limitation, provided you are not breaking the rules & guidelines below. In the interests of communication, we ask that you do not diverge from definitions of words that are found in the dictionary(s), unless a thread's specific purpose is to discuss various alternative definitions.

(February 18, 2014 at 1:11 pm)Esquilax Wrote:

(February 18, 2014 at 10:58 am)Jacob(smooth) Wrote: To take the matter at hand, the "people evolved from monkeys" thing. That's a nonsense spread by the uneducated to ridicule a model they don't understand. I'd like to see people question that. However if the explanation is pre or suffixed by "you fucking moron" (or variation) the explanation is more likely to be shrugged off as Atheists being hateful.

That's actually why I started out more "disappointed, but attempting to be reasonable," this time around; though the conduct is shameful, one has to allow for the possibility that this person just hasn't ever been exposed to correct information about evolution before. So I tried pointing out how continuing to use misrepresentations is lying by omission, and I linked to some references the guy could use to learn first.

He has, clearly, not done so, and has in fact repeated the same incorrect assertions again. I still corrected him, but we're now beyond the point where we can use honest ignorance as an excuse, and I don't think lies need to be treated gently.

There is, of course, a time and a place for everything...

(February 17, 2014 at 11:00 pm)Revelation777 Wrote: Reptiles evolved into birds, really? Based on what? If so why did some evolve and some didn't? Wouldn't of all reptiles of ceased to exist and there be just more birds? Who decides they stay a lizard and another will be a bird?

OMFG! I can't believe someone actually dragged out the old "Why are there still monkeys?" bullshit.

(February 18, 2014 at 4:12 pm)popeyespappy Wrote:

(February 17, 2014 at 11:00 pm)Revelation777 Wrote: Reptiles evolved into birds, really? Based on what? If so why did some evolve and some didn't? Wouldn't of all reptiles of ceased to exist and there be just more birds? Who decides they stay a lizard and another will be a bird?

OMFG! I can't believe someone actually dragged out the old "Why are there still monkeys?" bullshit.

He's done it multiple times, despite being provided an explanation.

He ignores the explanation, and re-states it: this time with "wouldn't of".

(February 18, 2014 at 4:12 pm)popeyespappy Wrote:

(February 17, 2014 at 11:00 pm)Revelation777 Wrote: Reptiles evolved into birds, really? Based on what? If so why did some evolve and some didn't? Wouldn't of all reptiles of ceased to exist and there be just more birds? Who decides they stay a lizard and another will be a bird?

OMFG! I can't believe someone actually dragged out the old "Why are there still monkeys?" bullshit.

Because creationists are like parrots. They just repeat the arguments they've heard numerous times. Though some think they're clever by changing the argument a litte, as in this case, from monkeys to reptiles.

Exactly. That makes it one we've never heard before. Right?

It does highlight the total disconnect that some theists have when it comes to evolution. They believe that evolution refers to a complete genetic overhaul that creates a whole new species in a single generation by "chance." Because something like this is so unlikely as to be impossible, scientists therefore disingenuously cover themselves by calling it a "theory." When you consider it from that perspective, it becomes obvious that "science" is lying, and the only possible explanation is that they seek to lead people away from god.

They reject the actual understanding of evolution because to do so means that they've been lied to, and god wouldn't let that happen to them... would he?