(March 14, 2014 at 10:54 pm)Huggy74 Wrote:

(March 14, 2014 at 10:44 pm)Aral Gamelon Wrote: You're right, he was only fully prepared to do it because Yahweh told him to, because that makes it better.

Actually there IS a big difference....

And if you bothered reading the story, Abraham already knew what the outcome would be.

Genesis 22:8
And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

The outcome is of no importance, just because Yahweh handed Abraham a scapegoat at the last minute doesn't mean he didn't submit two of his followers to extreme mental torture for shits and giggles.

Your god is a capricious, insecure monster.

By the by; don't presume to know what I've read.

(March 13, 2014 at 11:14 pm)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote: Have you forgotten the story about Abraham slicing and dicing Issac because some voice in his head told him to do it? People liked that story so much that they started several religions off of it.

And it got some screen time in the movies.

Funny shit.

(March 14, 2014 at 11:00 pm)Aral Gamelon Wrote:

(March 14, 2014 at 10:54 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: Actually there IS a big difference....

And if you bothered reading the story, Abraham already knew what the outcome would be.

Genesis 22:8
And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

The outcome is of no importance, just because Yahweh handed Abraham a scapegoat at the last minute doesn't mean he didn't submit two of his followers to extreme mental torture for shits and giggles.

Your god is a capricious, insecure monster.

By the by; don't presume to know what I've read.

I think it is safe to presume you don't know what your talking about.

All children of God are tested, Because in the end, they do not have to stand in the judgement, all their judgement takes place on earth.

Hebrews 12
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

If they pass the test and are found worthy to be a "son" or "daughter" then they shall inherit all that God has, and it is they who will judge the world.

1 Corinthians 6
2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

(March 14, 2014 at 11:00 pm)Aral Gamelon Wrote: Your god is a capricious, insecure monster.

let's say this is true for the sake of argument. Explain how defying him is going to work out for you?

(March 15, 2014 at 12:06 am)Huggy74 Wrote: I think it is safe to presume you don't know what your talking about.

The vast majority of my life spent as a Christian with a preacher grandfather and deep involvement in the church says differently. I think it's clear that your presumptions are founded upon bias and nothing more, churl, you know nothing of what I do and do not comprehend.

(March 15, 2014 at 12:06 am)Huggy74 Wrote: All children of God are tested, Because in the end, they do not have to stand in the judgement, all their judgement takes place on earth.

Hebrews 12
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

If they pass the test and are found worthy to be a "son" or "daughter" then they shall inherit all that God has, and it is they who will judge the world.

1 Corinthians 6
2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

Yes, I know what your bible says about trials and tribulations and the rewards thereafter. Would you like a cookie for copy and pasting?

This makes nothing about the story of Abraham and Isaac any better; the fact that Abraham, a father, would kill his son simply because his god told him to is fucking wretched and the god who commanded it even worse. No matter the outcome or rewards.

(March 14, 2014 at 11:00 pm)Aral Gamelon Wrote: Your god is a capricious, insecure monster.

(March 15, 2014 at 12:06 am)Huggy74 Wrote: let's say this is true for the sake of argument. Explain how defying him is going to work out for you?

Even if he were real, I wouldn't worship such a vile creature. End of story.

(March 15, 2014 at 12:25 am)Aral Gamelon Wrote: The vast majority of my life spent as a Christian with a preacher grandfather and deep involvement in the church says differently. I think it's clear that your presumptions are founded upon bias and nothing more, churl, you know nothing of what I do and do not comprehend.

Apparently you don't know that the old testament is all about Christ, and that particular story is symbolizing Christ (the ram) taking the place of the sinner (Issac).

John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

I could show you the symbology of the crucifixion displayed in the garden of Eden, but I guess you already knew that.

(March 15, 2014 at 1:04 am)Huggy74 Wrote:

(March 15, 2014 at 12:25 am)Aral Gamelon Wrote: The vast majority of my life spent as a Christian with a preacher grandfather and deep involvement in the church says differently. I think it's clear that your presumptions are founded upon bias and nothing more, churl, you know nothing of what I do and do not comprehend.

Apparently you don't know that the old testament is all about Christ, and that particular story is symbolizing Christ (the ram) taking the place of the sinner (Issac).

John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

I'm well aware, Christians see every part of the OT that they so wish as having to do with their savior, hardly a new idea. For clarity, so I know what I'm dealing with, are you a subscriber to a literal view of the bible or a moderate one?

(March 15, 2014 at 1:04 am)Huggy74 Wrote: I could show you the symbology of the crucifixion displayed in the garden of Eden, but I guess you already knew that.

Wouldn't add any credence to the stories even if it was there.

Quote:Apparently you don't know that the old testament is all about Christ, and that particular story is symbolizing Christ (the ram) taking the place of the sinner (Issac).

Another dickhead who thinks he can tell jews how to be jews on the basis of his made up crap.

Their made-up crap came long before yours, sonny.

(March 15, 2014 at 2:16 am)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:Apparently you don't know that the old testament is all about Christ, and that particular story is symbolizing Christ (the ram) taking the place of the sinner (Issac).

Another dickhead who thinks he can tell jews how to be jews on the basis of his made up crap.

Their made-up crap came long before yours, sonny.

I was going to touch on that head on, but figured I'd leave it couched in my reply to see if he'd catch it, but cat's out of the bag.

(March 15, 2014 at 1:04 am)Huggy74 Wrote:

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(March 15, 2014 at 12:25 am)Aral Gamelon Wrote: The vast majority of my life spent as a Christian with a preacher grandfather and deep involvement in the church says differently. I think it's clear that your presumptions are founded upon bias and nothing more, churl, you know nothing of what I do and do not comprehend.

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Apparently you don't know that the old testament is all about Christ, and that particular story is symbolizing Christ (the ram) taking the place of the sinner (Issac).

---

John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

I could show you the symbology of the crucifixion displayed in the garden of Eden, but I guess you already knew that.

---

I think it's a good idea to compare and contrast the temptation of Abraham with the temptation of Jesus. Abraham basically sold his soul to gain material riches and a legacy of worthless offspring. When Jesus was tempted he refused the offer. There's a lesson there even if both characters were imaginary. And even though Abraham went on to gain fame and fortune he was still a worthless pile of goat manure.