(December 21, 2014 at 3:16 pm)Pickup_shonuff Wrote: You said this occurred after your brain exploded at hell's gates?

... with all the force of a dud Ladyfinger.

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(December 21, 2014 at 3:50 pm)Beccs Wrote: We have the claims. Now, once more, we need to wait for the evidence.

(December 21, 2014 at 3:51 pm)Parkers Tan Wrote:

(December 21, 2014 at 3:16 pm)Pickup_shonuff Wrote: You said this occurred after your brain exploded at hell's gates?

... with all the force of a dud Ladyfinger.

Does explain a lot though. An exploded brain may account for the quality of his posts.

(December 21, 2014 at 1:03 pm)Nope Wrote: I used to be a Christian. My faith was important to me and something that I took for granted. In my forties, I began to have serious doubts and nothing that I could do would stop those doubts. Actually, at one point in my life I would get down on my face and beg god not to harden my heart. Questioning was traumatic for me and not something I asked to do. Every night I read my bible and my doubts grew.

what if your current unbelief was apart of the answer to the prayer you prayed?
What if in order for you not to live a lukewarm life/hard heart God had to send the wind and rain and take the house/faith you spent 40 years building?
That instead of being ignored, you were infact on the cusp of God opening your eyes, mind and Heart? All you need do at this point is to keep knocking.

Quote:The final straw came when my adolescent, learning disabled son got his girlfriend pregnant. We had given them birth control because we knew that they were sexually active even though my son-for whatever reason- told us that he wasn't having sex.

sometimes the LD can be very literal, and if he was not having sex the way he thinks about sex, then for him it doesn't count... Or he could just not want to goto you for things of that nature.

Quote: So yeah, I was disappointed in him and it was that disappointment that clicked something in my head. Never would I want my son to suffer because he upset me. There is nothing that he could do that would make me turn against him. He could try to kill me or hate me and I would still love him and want what was best for him. The god that I worshiped wanted people to go to a place of eternal misery because they didn't love him enough. He was supposed to be a parental figure and yet, I, the faulty human was a far better parent then he was.

Or maybe what 'clicked' is that God could not operate as you understand via the 40 old house/religious view told you he operates, and what clicked was you breaking from that unsupported view of Him.(you finding out your pervious beliefs were in error)

But rather than go back and say that 'I must have the wrong understanding of God let me start over and build a biblically based picture.' you assumed out of the 30k+ versions of Christianity you had the right one out of the gate, And rather than admit you could have had it wrong for 40 years, somehow it is more plausible that God couldn't exist.

This is the same pride of life that caused lucifer to fall from grace.
The idea that we are right and God must be the one in error.

I know you said you'd love your son even if he tried to kill you. In that, youre not making an accurate compareson to our (man in general) relationship with God.

A more accurate compareson would be to ask you would you love the son of an Enemy (ISIS type) who tried to kill you or worse yet your son? Repeatedly? What if he just visited hardship and torment to you or your son day in and day out?

The bible (Jesus Himself) clearly tells us not all belong to Him. Infact most do not belong to Him. that being the case, the question then becomes how far would you go to keep this enemy and his children from your family?

If you had it with in your means would you move your family to a gated community and provide them with the best life you could?

Would you invite your enemy or his son who still wants to kill you or your family to live with you? What if it meant death for them if they could not live under your roof?
(Remember it means death for your family if they come into your home.)

Now that is a biblical representation (apples to apples) compareson of the seperation of the wheat and weeds, the wheat and chaff, the sheep and the goats that Jesus speaks of. Why? Because as these parables tell us we are not all God's Children. The idea That we all belong to God's Family is a specific church doctrine and while it means good, it does not portray what biblical Christianity tells us.

Quote:At that point, I stopped believing and it stopped hurting that I didn't have belief any longer. So when Drich starts that nonsense about just believing I take offense.

Wait till you get to this point in my message if you were offended before.

(December 21, 2014 at 11:11 am)Drich Wrote: I converted from atheism

Every xtian does. We all start off without belief in weird shit and over the years. Unless you scrub like hell every time, the shit just builds up and pretty soon you're a full blown creatard or muslim human bomb.

(December 21, 2014 at 4:30 pm)Drich Wrote: [quote='Nope' pid='824979' dateline='1419181401']
I used to be a Christian. My faith was important to me and something that I took for granted. In my forties, I began to have serious doubts and nothing that I could do would stop those doubts. Actually, at one point in my life I would get down on my face and beg god not to harden my heart. Questioning was traumatic for me and not something I asked to do. Every night I read my bible and my doubts grew.

what if your current unbelief was apart of the answer to the prayer you prayed?

Quote:What if in order for you not to live a lukewarm life/hard heart God had to send the wind and rain and take the house/faith you spent 40 years building?

You are making a lot of assumptions about my level of faith. If I had been lukewarm, I wouldn't have been on my face on the floor. Some Christians believe that a real or true Christian can't lose their faith. Perhaps you are one of those. If that is true, you aren't able to accept that someone with faith equal to yours could walk away from Christianity because it means that you could be part of a lie.

Quote:That instead of being ignored, you were infact on the cusp of God opening your eyes, mind and Heart? All you need do at this point is to keep knocking.

I can't be ignored by something that doesn't exist. Not certain how long I was supposed to keep knocking. At some point, you have to accept that no one is going to answer

Quote:A more accurate compareson would be to ask you would you love the son of an Enemy (ISIS type) who tried to kill you or worse yet your son? Repeatedly? What if he just visited hardship and torment to you or your son day in and day out?

This is actually not a good comparison, at all. Repeatedly, the bible uses verses to describe god a parental figure. So, my relationship with my son is closer in similarity to the bible's concept of god/human relationship then enemy of mine who torments my family's relationship to me. Can you provide some biblical backing for your version of god's relationship to humans? Sometimes I suspect that you don't read your bible.

Quote:The bible (Jesus Himself) clearly tells us not all belong to Him. Infact most do not belong to Him. that being the case, the question then becomes how far would you go to keep this enemy and his children from your family?

Jesus said that those who don't feed the hungry, clothe the naked or visit those in prison do not belong to him and he won't know them. That is a far cry from the god from your version of god as described in this post.

Quote:If you had it with in your means would you move your family to a gated community and provide them with the best life you could?

No. Why would I move my family to a gated community?

Drich, I have read several of your posts. You don't seem to have read your own holy book.

(December 21, 2014 at 3:16 pm)Pickup_shonuff Wrote: Which Scripture do you think that's referring to and why? According to your logic it might be implying that the Qur'an, The Book of Mormon, or hell, The Origin of Species, is "given by inspiration." Newton's genius certainly shamed your prophets.

In the orginal greek the word for scripture is 'graphe' it means written word. We know Paul wrote this to Timmothy a deciple of Paul.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexi...1124&t=KJV

So 'scripture' would include anything Paul exposed Timothy to.

Paul did not use any of the other books you mentioned to teach Timothy.

Quote:You're saying you asked God and he told you he authored these books? You said this occurred after your brain exploded at hell's gates?

God confirmed the validity of the bible through what has happened since I turned my life over to Him. In that in the bible God makes specific promises. He full filled those promises to me.

I looked at my orginal thread again, and do not see where I said "my brain exploded."

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(December 21, 2014 at 3:18 pm)Beccs Wrote: I guess some atheists do have weak minds. I jump to this conclusion after reading many former atheists stories of their conversion and the reasons for them.

Admitting there is a problem is the first step in finding a solution.

(December 21, 2014 at 8:51 pm)Drich Wrote: In the orginal greek the word for scripture is 'graphe' it means written word. We know Paul wrote this to Timmothy a deciple of Paul.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexi...1124&t=KJV

Wrong. Do your homework, bud. Most scholars now believe the evidence of authorship points to an unknown writer belonging to a Pauline community. Even so, think about your rationale: Human X claims to be divine. Therefore, X is divine. Like I keep repeating, you pace in circles elevating men to the status of God to justify their words as relating to God's authority over man.

(December 21, 2014 at 8:51 pm)Drich Wrote: So 'scripture' would include anything Paul exposed Timothy to.

Paul did not use any of the other books you mentioned to teach Timothy.

What books did he expose him to? Please refer me to his given list. Oh yeah, that's right, he doesn't give one.

(December 21, 2014 at 8:51 pm)Drich Wrote: God confirmed the validity of the bible through what has happened since I turned my life over to Him. In that in the bible God makes specific promises. He full filled those promises to me.

I looked at my orginal thread again, and do not see where I said "my brain exploded."

So, to answer the OP, you're basically saying that only atheists who haven't sufficiently thought about the arguments are liable to convert.

I'm inclined to agree since this is precisely what you and your ilk have repeatedly demonstrated.

Quote:God confirmed the validity of the bible through what has happened since I turned my life over to Him. In that in the bible God makes specific promises. He full filled those promises to me.

What were those promises? If you have proof, why not give it to us. Doesn't the fact that god proved himself to you discount the reason for free will?

I thought that Christians weren't supposed to test god.

(December 21, 2014 at 3:19 pm)watchamadoodle Wrote: That's an interesting story, but it doesn't necessarily mean that Christianity is true.

this happened 20+ years ago. This one event was just the start of a series of events that convinced me of God. The really special thing is that I myself am no one special. Everything that has happened to me God has offered to each of us.

Quote: In fact, believiing in Christianity requires you to ignore the historical evidence indicating fundamental changes to Judaism and Christianity over the centuries - not at all like God was inspiring those religions.

Such as?

Quote:Also, if Christianity is true, we should expect to see God doing something, and scientists should be able to measure that activity. Even if God's activity is limited to helping Christians find their car keys more often than non-Christians, this affect should be measurable.

why would God grovel to us by dotting the 'i's' and crossing the 't's that we demand?

As it is we have access to God if we meet Him on His terms, not ours.

Quote:So there are many reasons to disbelieve in Christianity, and if you know about hallucinations, then you should be very skeptical of guardian angels bumming money off you at a convenience store. If the guardian angel was a hallucination, then of course it would know everything about your life. If you were inspired by predictions of the hallucination, then you might work hard to fulfill those predictions.

If a guardian angel tells you that 1 + 1 = 3, are you going to believe him? Christianity is the equivalent of 1 + 1 = 3. (IMO)

or everything played out as I said. Again this was for my edification, and not yours. But, that said God offers the same Holy Spirit that has been working with me, to also work with anyone else who A/S/K for Him.

Quote:EDIT: Even if you accept that you experienced something supernatural, it would be more reasonable to suspect that you were simply hearing a message from some non-Christian entity in the language of your religious beliefs. For example, in the Martian Chronicles, a martian appeared to be Jesus to a priest, because that was the language the priest would understand.

Even if this person was not Christian He supported and pushed me towards Christianity.

(December 21, 2014 at 9:14 pm)Drich Wrote: why would God grovel to us by dotting the 'i's' and crossing the 't's that we demand?

And you said god proved the bible's accuracy to you. So, he crossed the t's and dotted i's for you but doesn't save the children that are raped, little girls who are having their gentiles mutated or people starving to death. How does that not seen terrible to you?