I don't understand; why do people defend things such as the confederate flag

[Gawdzilla Sama]

The South was afraid that, among other things, that the North would dominate the House of Representatives due to a larger population. They also worried that the industrial power of the North would lead the Yankees into a dominant position in the arms industry and so have a larger influence with the military.

Every year the Secretary of the Army and Secretary of the Navy had to report the following with regard to new officers:

Place of birth.
Place of residence when inducted.
Place of residence of the person making the nomination (to the military academies, or as On-the-Job officer trainees.
Several more items I don't recall off the top of my head, but the South was keeping a close eye on the future commanding generals and admirals.

[The Grand Nudger]

At a more personal level (as in, the people who actually had to pull the triggers), southerners were fed a nonstop torrent of disinformation.   It would have been very, very difficult to make all those poor southerners fight for the slave owners without the use of conflating rationalizations.

They worried that ragged armies of immigrant yankee soldiers were going to overrun their homes any moment now, and make off with all the white women and what-not. Before you giggle...understand that this still works today, lol.

[Amarok]

Canada. 
We rebels repatriated our constitution from the UK through an agreement, not through war.

I wouldn't exactly call that a rebellion.

It was a rebellion of ideas not weapons

Thou we have had a fair few of those too

[Aroura]

Because the south wanted independence specifically so they could continue the practice of slavery. 

The colonies wanted independence from unfair taxation.

Apples and oranges.

They South wanted independence from the North for other reasons besides just slavery. I know this is a subject of debate between historians, but I don't think it's fair to say it was a sole reason.  

Since the Confederate flag is offensive to so many people, I think out of respect for those people it would be better to stop waiving it around. But at the same time, I'm not going to accuse someone who does of being racist/pro slavery if they are saying the flag does not represent those things to them. I may say they are insensitive, out of touch, etc... but not racist.

There was also more to the colonial rebellion than unfair taxation without representation.

I was discussing the main, driving forces.  I at no time claimed these were the only reasons.

To try and downplay the role that slavery played in the civil war strikes me as odd. Why are you so eager to defend the southern states on their stances on slavery? 

I'll let the first state to secede speak for itself
"On Dec. 24, 1860, delegates at South Carolina’s secession convention adopted a “Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union.” It noted “an increasing hostility on the part of the non-slaveholding States to the institution of slavery” and protested that Northern states had failed to “fulfill their constitutional obligations” by interfering with the return of fugitive slaves to bondage. Slavery, not states’ rights, birthed the Civil War.

Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union

[Amarok]

Ah the tired " but there were other reasons argument" by that logic we could justify any evil regimes idea's

Oh no we should not focus on Nazi regimes racial idea's. We should focus on the Treaty of Versailles and how unfairly Germany was treated after WW1 etc etc .

Therefore we should have Nuremburg reenactments and statues of Rommel everywhere after all he was noble guy. And some of the soldiers didn't follow Hitler's ideas they were just patriots  etc etc.

[Catholic_Lady]

They South wanted independence from the North for other reasons besides just slavery. I know this is a subject of debate between historians, but I don't think it's fair to say it was a sole reason.  

Since the Confederate flag is offensive to so many people, I think out of respect for those people it would be better to stop waiving it around. But at the same time, I'm not going to accuse someone who does of being racist/pro slavery if they are saying the flag does not represent those things to them. I may say they are insensitive, out of touch, etc... but not racist.

There was also more to the colonial rebellion than unfair taxation without representation.

I was discussing the main, driving forces.  I at no time claimed these were the only reasons.

To try and downplay the role that slavery played in the civil war strikes me as odd. Why are you so eager to defend the southern states on their stances on slavery? 

I'll let the first state to secede speak for itself
"On Dec. 24, 1860, delegates at South Carolina’s secession convention adopted a “Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union.” It noted “an increasing hostility on the part of the non-slaveholding States to the institution of slavery” and protested that Northern states had failed to “fulfill their constitutional obligations” by interfering with the return of fugitive slaves to bondage. Slavery, not states’ rights, birthed the Civil War.

Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union

When you said "the South wanted independence specifically because of slavery" I thought you were saying that this was the sole reason. I agree it was a reason. But don't think it's fair to say it was the main reason.

As for my motives, I have no dog in this fight. I grew up in the North and was never from a Southern state. I just feel like there's this popular idea of the Civil War being all about slavery when it wasn't. I wonder if it might be due to some underlying dislike/prejudice of Southerners and Southern culture, which is why I speak up. I'm not saying that's the case with you, just in general I wonder if that may be a factor sometimes.

[Aroura]

There was also more to the colonial rebellion than unfair taxation without representation.

I was discussing the main, driving forces.  I at no time claimed these were the only reasons.

To try and downplay the role that slavery played in the civil war strikes me as odd. Why are you so eager to defend the southern states on their stances on slavery? 

I'll let the first state to secede speak for itself
"On Dec. 24, 1860, delegates at South Carolina’s secession convention adopted a “Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union.” It noted “an increasing hostility on the part of the non-slaveholding States to the institution of slavery” and protested that Northern states had failed to “fulfill their constitutional obligations” by interfering with the return of fugitive slaves to bondage. Slavery, not states’ rights, birthed the Civil War.

Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union

When you said "the South wanted independence specifically because of slavery" I thought you were saying that this was the sole reason. I agree it was a reason. But don't think it's fair to say it was the main reason.

As for my motives, I have no dog in this fight. I grew up in the North and was never from a Southern state. I just feel like there's this popular idea of the Civil War being all about slavery when it wasn't. I wonder if it might be due to some underlying dislike/prejudice of Southerners and Southern culture, which is why I speak up. I'm not saying that's the case with you, just in general I wonder if that may be a factor sometimes.

The south has many wonderful traditions and a rich culture that I find beautiful and fascinating.  When have I ever said anything nasty about southerners?  There are many wonderful people who live in the south, and many rat bastards who live in the north.

But I won't go so far as to deny slavery being the main reason for their secession.  That's just dishonest. They themselves said so at the time!  Yes, there were many, many reasons, and a lot of massive disagreements leading up to it.  But the straw that broke that camels back was slavery, it became the driving force.  That does not make every southerner in 1860 a racist, nor every northerner a paragon of virtue, nor am I saying that, or even alluding to it.

I love Germany, despite atrocities committed by some people there in the past.  People need to own up to their mistakes, not make excuses for them.  I respect people who do the former, as the Germans have done.

[Silver]

The south has many wonderful traditions and a rich culture that I find beautiful and fascinating.  When have I ever said anything nasty about southerners?  There are many wonderful people who live in the south, and many rat bastards who live in the north.

But I won't go so far as to deny slavery being the main reason for their secession.  That's just dishonest. They themselves said so at the time!  Yes, there were many, many reasons, and a lot of massive disagreements leading up to it.  But the straw that broke that camels back was slavery, it became the driving force.  That does not make every southerner in 1860 a racist, nor every northerner a paragon of virtue, nor am I saying that, or even alluding to it.

I love Germany, despite atrocities committed by some people there in the past.  People need to own up to their mistakes, not make excuses for them.  I respect people who do the former, as the Germans have done.

I agree.

Any single area of the world is filled with both good and bad people. There is no escaping that.

However, according to my boyfriend the one place he will never live is Alabama. And the one place I will never live is Texas.

[Catholic_Lady]

Yes, I agree it was the straw that broke the camel's back, but as you said they were already unhappy about a lot of things and itching for their independence for some time coming.

---

The south has many wonderful traditions and a rich culture that I find beautiful and fascinating.  When have I ever said anything nasty about southerners?  There are many wonderful people who live in the south, and many rat bastards who live in the north.

But I won't go so far as to deny slavery being the main reason for their secession.  That's just dishonest. They themselves said so at the time!  Yes, there were many, many reasons, and a lot of massive disagreements leading up to it.  But the straw that broke that camels back was slavery, it became the driving force.  That does not make every southerner in 1860 a racist, nor every northerner a paragon of virtue, nor am I saying that, or even alluding to it.

I love Germany, despite atrocities committed by some people there in the past.  People need to own up to their mistakes, not make excuses for them.  I respect people who do the former, as the Germans have done.

I agree.

Any single area of the world is filled with both good and bad people.  There is no escaping that.

However, according to my boyfriend the one place he will never live is Alabama.  And the one place I will never live is Texas.

You'd love Austin. 

San Antonio, Dallas, and Houston are cool too.

[Amarok]

I never implied everyone in the south is bad merely that this specific period of history while should be studied and acknowledge just is not something that should be honored as a glowing notion of heroism