If Not Hell then what?

[archangle]

If you believe Hell to be immoral or just plain wrong, then what would you suggest God do with those who do not want to serve Him for eternity?

He does nothing but wait for you to turn and look into the light. But you have to understand, that some are looking into a false light. From fear, or otherwise.

[Esquilax]

As a bible based Christian I do not have the luxuary of changing things around simply because they do not fit with my personal morality.

I think I just laughed so hard I broke a rib.

If the bible says Hell is a bad place then I must teach/believe Hell to be a bad place.

Unless you can demonstrate the reality of the bible then you're not justified in teaching/believing that hell is anything.

What if He deems Hell a suitable place for those who have sinned? Why would he look to resolve anything?

I'm not going to add onto the fan fiction, here; this was in response to your question asking what my alternative to hell would be. Whether or not god would do that is a different question that I hadn't addressed.

Science has only taken a handfull of people anywhere outside the bounds of of this planet. I believe God is offering total independance for His followers to explore all of His creation.

When you talk about science like that, could you at least do the honest thing and append "... so far," to the end of your statements? Because eventually, science will prove you wrong, over and over, and it will be fucking glorious to behold the very real, demonstrable vistas that technology will show us.

If the God of creation tells you 'x' is true, then 'x' is true. Realistically what else do you have to go on? What other people observe about 'x' for a single point and time in space?

Given that you haven't demonstrated that A: the god of creation is real, B: the things in the bible are accurate depictions of the words of such a being, C: that your interpretation of those words is at all accurate and not a reflection of your own psyche, and D: that you are, via personal revelation or what have you, in contact with such a god, I am entirely justified in not believing anything you or any other theist says about 'x' until they stump up on points A through D.

The thing is we are all slated to be 'stabbed in the chest.' The good news is that we have all be provided with armor if we do not want to die. The only thing is we have to put it on ourselves.

Please finish the analogy: the armor is being sold to you by the guy currently about to stab you, and at the low low cost of eternal grovelling obedience. It's only good news if you aren't aware that the man giving you the solution is also the cause of the problem.

Red herring, or did you stop reading the story half way through? If so keep reading.

Not a red herring, read the entire context of my post: my claim wasn't about the eventual ending of the fable, but that there was Abraham, a man who was entirely willing to follow a demonstrably immoral order from a god soaked in blood; the immorality of the order in no way dictates whether or not people will follow it, and the fact that the order was rescinded in the end in no way influences that concept.

What I told Minnie was the only 'absolute proof' I can offer is to kill you and send you to the after life so you can see for yourself. The only thing is that it will be a one way ticket. So why not ask God as out lined in luke 11 to provide you with 'absolute proof' while you are still in this life?

Because presuppositional reasoning is the worst thing ever and I refuse to take any part of it on principle.

[Drich]

Where did you get all this amazing info from?

The bible.

So was satan in hell while he was tempting Christ or was that a day trip out that god allowed?

No, Satan and his buddies are here. As per the exchange Jesus had with Legion, The book of Job, Genesis, and revelations.

So bad things happen to good people because the earth is nearly satans kingdom, while he is burning forever in hell, except when god allows him to come out and tempt his son. Seems simple enough.

Ah, no. Satan and his demons have not be sent to Hell yet. They are here. this is their realm. When God cast Satan out of Heaven in or near the beginnig He did not throw them into Hell. He cast them out of Heaven and onto the Earth. Which the remain until the final judgement.
Again this is witnessed by satan's persence in many of the books of the bible, and by the exchange Legion had with Christ. In some translations it says "Jesus Son of God do not Judge us before it is time, While others says Legion Pleaded with Jesus not to send them to the bottomless pit/Hell.

Satan is here, this is his kingdom, or rather the cloest thing he has to one, and if you think Satan resides in Hell and controls from there, you are confusing Greek mythology with Biblical Christianity.

[LastPoet]

How many metric tons of bullshit are these... christians willing to pile on in the name of their delusion? I accept wagers...

[Drich]

So was satan in hell while he was tempting Christ or was that a day trip out that god allowed?

As far as I could ever tell, the Bible talks about Satan eventually being sent to Hell. But otherwise he is free to roam the world and do as much damage as he can. The Bible even indicates that he had freedom to roam in Heaven; the book of Job begins with him wandering about up there, and the book of Revelations implies that a future war in Heaven would result in Satan being cast down to Earth, never to return.

If you're wondering why the Devil is left alive after his part in introducing sin into the world, you're not alone.

To do God's work. God can only ever repersent His expressed will. Satan offers oppsition to that Will. In essence Satan repersents choice, or the freedom to choose a will outside of God's. It is God's will that we be given choice.

[purplepurpose]

Person life is limited.
Good deeds or sins cant result in eternal consuquences.
Hell and paradise are temporary acording to karma.
If there is no hell(temporary torture) then there would be chaos.
Its like if there wouldnt he jail in the country, whole country would turn in to hell. Hell is painful penalty, paradise is sweet reward - both temporary. Its an endless cycle of karma.

[LastPoet]

[Angrboda]

Let's suppose, for the sake of argument, that every person who wrote a book of the bible wrote it as a complete work of fiction. With Genesis, that's an easy sell. But people took these books, originally written as fiction in order to spoof or fool other people, and assumed they were real truthful additions to the collection of holy texts. The more people took them seriously, the more people wrote 'spoofs' of those books, which in turn got taken seriously. We need not know the reasons why exactly, because people write satires and fan fiction and forgeries all the time. It's not impossible that the author of every book of the bible self-consciously knew it to be untrue, a work of fiction, and only later was it taken to be true by the Jews and Christians.

So we have a real possibility that all the books of the bible are fictional, and that them being fiction is their correct interpretation. My question to you Drich, is how do you know that this is not the proper interpretation?

(And I'll stress the word 'know' — how do you know this is not the case, not simply that you believe it isn't the case. After all, what you're asking of us in return is quite substantial; a mere 'whim' of belief won't cut it.)

[The Grand Nudger]

God speaks to some people through their car stereo as they travel alone down country roads - these people "know"...they don't simply "believe" Apo.....

[Strongbad]

God speaks to some people through their car stereo as they travel alone down country roads - these people "know"...they don't simply "believe" Apo.....

Yeah, but we know that Drich got the heebie-jeebies about hell from an ACTUAL DREAM, not his car stereo, so his authority cannot be questioned!