Hell and the Play Nice Christian

[FatAndFaithless]

God must've been shit at anatomy then, because he certainly hasn't left an imprint on my heart. Now my bowels on the other hand... I've had some absolutely divine shits in my day. Maybe he just missed the mark.

[YGninja]

The knowledge of God, and his laws, is put into your heart. Whether you follow them or not is entirely at your discretion. The Bible isnt the map, rather just an explanation of it.

If this were true, judaism/christianity would have sprung up all over the world, in cultures that had never encountered each other. Instead, these religiouns started in one place, and branched out from there. So no, knowledge of your god is no written into our hearts, and the bible is a very poor map that leaves its followers running around in circles while killing each other over misunderstandings and interpretations.

GodsChild, justice is not about reward and punishment. Even the most evil Humans know how to reward those who please them, and punish those who don't, if they have any sense. Justice is about intent, and equality. Any reward or punishment is proportional to the crime, and good and evil should be determined by objective means. Not because the strongest person says what he likes is good, and what he doesn't like is evil.

No, the morality which God implanted into our hearts would have sprung up everywhere, and it has, and this is why Christianity has been accepted atleast to some degree neigh on everywhere it has been taught, because it resonates with what people instinctually feel. This is why the latest international studies from Oxford Uni have concluded that children left alone to develop on a desert island with no outside interference, would come to believe in God, while they would have to be taught atheism.

[FatAndFaithless]

Continuing the divine dooke theme from my previous post.

Holy shit you're either utterly ignorant of how religions form or you're HM-Drich megazord levels of dishonest.

[robvalue]

Taught atheism? How would that work? They'd come up with a series of god claims so that they could teach that they were not true?

[Crossless2.0]

No, the morality which God implanted into our hearts would have sprung up everywhere, and it has, and this is why Christianity has been accepted atleast to some degree neigh on everywhere it has been taught, because it resonates with what people instinctually feel. This is why the latest international studies from Oxford Uni have concluded that children left alone to develop on a desert island with no outside interference, would come to believe in God, while they would have to be taught atheism.

Citation seriously fucking needed.

[FatAndFaithless]

No, the morality which God implanted into our hearts would have sprung up everywhere, and it has, and this is why Christianity has been accepted atleast to some degree neigh on everywhere it has been taught, because it resonates with what people instinctually feel. This is why the latest international studies from Oxford Uni have concluded that children left alone to develop on a desert island with no outside interference, would come to believe in God, while they would have to be taught atheism.

Citation seriously fucking needed.

I'd actually be willing to agree that a study like that is likely to exist (though in a much more coherent and less pulled-out-his-ass form, certainly not just 'dropping kids on a desert island'), but that just illustrates the process through which religions are started. Creating stories to explain unknown events and attributing them to higher beings is the modus operandi for fledgling religions. I don't know how YGninja thinks the Egyptian or Greek or Hindu pantheons started, but it's very much like people experiencing natural phenomena and, lacking sufficient explanation with the information we have nowadays, creating their 'best guess' usually illustrated through stories and myths.

YGninja's own points undercut his conclusions from the very start.

(Not even mentioning the tribes in South America that have no God concept at all)

[Mister Agenda]

If this were true, judaism/christianity would have sprung up all over the world, in cultures that had never encountered each other. Instead, these religiouns started in one place, and branched out from there. So no, knowledge of your god is no written into our hearts, and the bible is a very poor map that leaves its followers running around in circles while killing each other over misunderstandings and interpretations.

GodsChild, justice is not about reward and punishment. Even the most evil Humans know how to reward those who please them, and punish those who don't, if they have any sense. Justice is about intent, and equality. Any reward or punishment is proportional to the crime, and good and evil should be determined by objective means. Not because the strongest person says what he likes is good, and what he doesn't like is evil.

No, the morality which God implanted into our hearts would have sprung up everywhere, and it has, and this is why Christianity has been accepted atleast to some degree neigh on everywhere it has been taught, because it resonates with what people instinctually feel. This is why the latest international studies from Oxford Uni have concluded that children left alone to develop on a desert island with no outside interference, would come to believe in God, while they would have to be taught atheism.

Islam seems to resonate with what people instinctually feel even more, considering the rate at which it is growing. It's already larger than Catholicism or Protestantism, and they had an 800 year head start.

And children are supertstition-prone, not 'natural theists'. They'd likely come up with some kind of animism. To reach that conclusion, Oxford had to conflate a tendency to attribute agency where there is not to theism. That's not very flattering to theism, when you think about it.

[Crossless2.0]

I'd actually be willing to agree that a study like that is likely to exist (though in a much more coherent and less pulled-out-his-ass form, certainly not just 'dropping kids on a desert island'), but that just illustrates the process through which religions are started. Creating stories to explain unknown events and attributing them to higher beings is the modus operandi for fledgling religions. I don't know how YGninja thinks the Egyptian or Greek or Hindu pantheons started, but it's very much like people experiencing natural phenomena and, lacking sufficient explanation with the information we have nowadays, creating their 'best guess' usually illustrated through stories and myths.

YGninja's own points undercut his conclusions from the very start.

(Not even mentioning the tribes in South America that have no God concept at all)

Oh, I don't doubt that there's some study that he is misrepresenting. I just want to see it for myself. Judging by his misguided and dishonest argument regarding the 1st Amendment, I would require independent corroboration if he told me the sky appeared blue on a cloudless day. Just another believer willing to lie for Jesus.

[Chad32]

If this were true, judaism/christianity would have sprung up all over the world, in cultures that had never encountered each other. Instead, these religiouns started in one place, and branched out from there. So no, knowledge of your god is no written into our hearts, and the bible is a very poor map that leaves its followers running around in circles while killing each other over misunderstandings and interpretations.

GodsChild, justice is not about reward and punishment. Even the most evil Humans know how to reward those who please them, and punish those who don't, if they have any sense. Justice is about intent, and equality. Any reward or punishment is proportional to the crime, and good and evil should be determined by objective means. Not because the strongest person says what he likes is good, and what he doesn't like is evil.

No, the morality which God implanted into our hearts would have sprung up everywhere, and it has, and this is why Christianity has been accepted atleast to some degree neigh on everywhere it has been taught, because it resonates with what people instinctually feel. This is why the latest international studies from Oxford Uni have concluded that children left alone to develop on a desert island with no outside interference, would come to believe in God, while they would have to be taught atheism.

So if this morality could spring up before Jesus was even born, what's the point of christianity? What's the point of starting a religion, and spreading the word that everyone already knows, to the point of killing people who don't cnvert to a sometimes narrow version of christianity?

I would like to see this study. Given how many gods people have believed in, not to mention lesser spirits, I doubt that very many children growing up without learning about Jesus would believe in the same god you believe in.

[YGninja]

Citation seriously fucking needed.

I'd actually be willing to agree that a study like that is likely to exist (though in a much more coherent and less pulled-out-his-ass form, certainly not just 'dropping kids on a desert island'), but that just illustrates the process through which religions are started. Creating stories to explain unknown events and attributing them to higher beings is the modus operandi for fledgling religions. I don't know how YGninja thinks the Egyptian or Greek or Hindu pantheons started, but it's very much like people experiencing natural phenomena and, lacking sufficient explanation with the information we have nowadays, creating their 'best guess' usually illustrated through stories and myths.

YGninja's own points undercut his conclusions from the very start.

(Not even mentioning the tribes in South America that have no God concept at all)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion...laims.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics...study.html
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/201...103828.htm