Why is it so hard to be openly atheist in today's world

[AFTT47]

Welcome, Ghost. I live in Phoenix too. I've never had any significant problems in my 55 years around the US and Guam and I've been out since I was 12 years old. Maybe attitude has something to do with it. You know how an animal can sense fear? Maybe Christians can sense when an atheist is hesitant to come out. I have never been the least bit shy about it and have gone straight for the jugular the few times anyone as taken me to task for my atheism.

I'm sorry about your acquaintance but that's what she is. She's no friend. It's her loss.

[SteelCurtain]

Yeah I think it's all about confidence and how you present yourself.

I, for one, do not broadcast my atheism in my professional life at all. If you ask me or make a particularly inane comment, I'll let you know, but I am not proactively putting it out there. I have never felt like I was discriminated against.

But I've also not had a friend cease to be my friend over it, too. I could imagine that would be tough to deal with. I wonder if it's the type of people you choose to hang around with? Or for me the fact that I've never really ever chosen even moderately religious people to really get close with or hand around with at all, so that wouldn't really apply to me. Maybe that's the real advantage of never really believing. I never immersed myself in the church community, so every single one of my friends remained my friends after I put a label on it.

I feel a little more thankful that my mind works the way it does.

[Esquilax]

Isn't this just the outworking of evolution? How can you kick about it?
Is there some Standard you are really appealing to?

Aren't you ashamed to know so little about evolution, but speak so declaratively about it?

[bennyboy]

It's not hard.

[Alex K]

Welcome to the forums, Ghost!

Why is it so hard to be openly atheist in today's world

Not in this here country...

[Thumpalumpacus]

I don't know what part you live in but that is a big state, just like parts of my state are different attitudes than other parts of my state. I'd say it depends on who and where.

Exactly my point. America is a huge country, and my interlocutor assuming it's a "theocracy" because of what he read in the news isn't really sound reasoning, given that the media is interested in ratings and readership more than accuracy and integrity.

I live about 30 miles west of Austin, out in the country. Plenty of religious folk, and plenty of secularists/agnostics/atheists too.

---

Also it depends if these are family, close friends, or whatever. There are lots of people who might say "have a blessed day" without intending to discuss what you believe. In college, I remember debating religion with close friends a few times, but our differences didn't harm our friendships. (I was a Christian at the time. Maybe it would have seemed different if I was an atheist.) Family members are more likely to worry and pray as opposed to debate (in my experience).

I've found that firm courtesy usually gets the job done, in my family and circle of friends. I've lost a couple of friends due to my atheism (the whole "we cannot be friends if you don't accept Jesus" thing) -- back in California. No one here has told me that, either in the 2 1/2 years since I've returned, or in the years I lived here before moving to California.

If someone gives me the little "have a blessed day", I take it with the grace they intended. They're not proselytizing, and I'm not going to ask them to address me in secular terms. I've had a couple of people assume that I was a believer because of my sunny disposition (hard to believe, I know), and when I responded in the negative, they were surprised., but still polite. I wonder if they had one of their stereotypes about atheists pierced at that moment?

Anyway, I get along with anyone who doesn't get in my face about matters either religious or secular. Respect is repaid in kind, as is boorishness.

[Brian37]

At least here in the United States. I live in Phoenix, Arizona which is dominated heavily by Catholics and Mormons and other Christian denominations. I had this really good friend who was Mormon, and we've been best friends since Freshman year. And just last November I told her I didn't believe in God and she got quite mad about it and said that she didn't want to be my friend anymore because of it. What's ironic is that her other excuse is that she only wanted to hang around people who believed in God because they're a better influence, but she's the one who goes to Vegas and drinks and grinds with random men at clubs.

It seems like all we really want is to just be treated equally and not like subhumans or second class. I read somewhere that an open atheist cannot run for office in this country. (Not 100% how true that is, but if someone knows anymore on this; please, let me know). I don't go around forcing my atheism on others. But apparently Christians somehow think they should be permitted to force their religious beliefs down everyone's throats through government and such. But if someone who's an atheist lets out a small little peep, they will demonized and publicly shammed for it. At least in the part of the country I live in.

This is just something I've never understood.

Now I do know that atheism is widely accepted in countries in Northern Europe.

Hi Ghost: America is going through this weird cultural phase of coming out of the closet about beliefs, and "treating them equally" where big FAILS are happening left and right.

Neutral is being open to either approach, theistic or nontheistic approach,
and/or some people operate better as agnostic leaning one way or the other.
Anything other than neutral is going to get political because the media and culture is so hyped up right now about that.

What gets people in trouble is assuming that if someone is theistic they are AGAINST nontheists, and if someone is nontheistic they are AGAINST theist beliefs.

Best position I'd recommend is not to reject or react to one more than the other.

If you can identify as Nontheistic, that is a bit more neutral sounding than being a- or anti- which implies without or against. Just being nontheistic means secular but isn't resisting rejecting or excluding something actively. It implies not personifying God as a figure, but still leaves it open that God can mean something else, just not a concrete person or thing.

I consider Buddhism to be nontheistic because Wisdom is another name for God. so it isn't anti-God it just doesn't Personify God as personal authority or creator figure. The Creation or Universe, Life or Nature can be names for God but in an impersonal form, and still be a nontheistic approach to Life that isn't anti-God.

UM NO, Buddhism is no patent holder on our species morality. The history of Asia and the Orient has had its own divisions and tribal wars even with the existence of Buddhism. They are no better than any other religion, they are still human invented constructs.

"Wisdom" is not another name for God. How about skip the metaphor crap and understand that there is nothing new under the sun. Religions, including non theistic Buddhism, still are clubs that form groups to set up social orders. No religions were ever required for evolution to occur. Dinosaurs existed without religion, cockroaches and bacteria evolved without it.

I would highly recommend if you have not, read Victor Stinger's "New Atheism", it not only addresses god claims, but also addresses the religions of Asia and the Orient as well.

The point of the book is to point out that not only science does have something to say about god claims, but it also points out that our species morality is in us, not the clubs we invent.

You can find all sorts of motifs that promote kindness, or "wisdom" in every religion. Victor, and I agree, says that should tell humans that or morality is in our evolution.

I agree. Not even the word "atheist" will make the individual automatically good or bad. Our species ability to be cruel or compassionate is in us. Hiding behind labels as if they are patent holders of morality like a product invented in a factory, is absurd.

You have prisons in every nation in the world. You have parents in every nation in the world. You group just like every group in the world. Our labels are really our species way of justifying social pecking orders. In reality evolution is not concerned what wins. It is our modern awareness of our own psychology and evolution that can help us avoid conflict.

Buddhism is no more a cure to the planet's problems than any other religion. It is merely a construct humans center their lives around. Whatever good or moral act, or good word said in Buddhism, you can find in all religious tropes. It still amounts to a personal predilection. Otherwise why would Buddhist countries have prisons as well?

[zebo-the-fat]

When I called it a theocracy I may have been exaggerating a little, just going off things I have read in the press (not the most accurate source of information I know!) Here in the UK I can't imagine the subject ever coming up at a job interview or something like that. (I only found out a week or so ago that a guy I have worked with for over 10 years was religious... the subject has never been mentioned)

[Norman Humann]

Why is it so hard to be openly atheist in today's world

Not in this here country...

Lucky bastard

[Pyrrho]

... I read somewhere that an open atheist cannot run for office in this country. (Not 100% how true that is, but if someone knows anymore on this; please, let me know). ...

As others have noted, you can run. However, your chance of winning will usually be rather slim. This is because many religious people will vote against you just for being an atheist.

So, if you want to be president, you will almost certainly need to say you believe in God, and you probably better claim some sort of Christian belief.


And this, I think, justifies an off-hand remark about the U.S. being a theocracy. That and the fact that many religionists want to put their religious beliefs into law and to have the government advertise their religion on public property. Also, one can look at our money, all of which has "In God We Trust" on it. That isn't a proper thing for a secular government at all.