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The idea of God always existing
RE: The idea of God always existing
(December 3, 2012 at 2:10 am)Undeceived Wrote: Entropy: a measure inversely related to the energy available for work in a physical system. So imagine the line above running in a downwards slope from the beginning of time.

Isn't it wonderful when people just change the definitions of physical quantities, jut to suit their arguments?

http://www.encyclopedia.com/topic/entropy.aspx Wrote:Entropy as a measure of disorder can be shown to depend on the probability that the particles of a system are in a given state of order. The tendency for entropy to increase occurs because the number of possible states of disorder that a system can assume is greater than the number of more ordered states, making a state of disorder more probable. For example, the entropy of the ordered state of the water molecules in ice crystal is less than it is when the crystal is melted to liquid water. The entropy difference involved corresponds to the transfer of heat to the crystal in order to melt it.

If you take the Universe to be a system, the overall Entropy is always on the rise. I even once heard the case to define positive time as the direction of increasing entropy.

Anyway, the more entropy, the less the energy density of the system. If you payed attention to classes, you would know that physics tells you that energy cannot be created nor destroyed.
The continuous increase in entropy in the Universe only means that as time goes by, you get less and less energy per unit volume... tends to zero, but only when you get to infinite time/entropy, so it will never get there.

When you go back in time to the big bang, or better, the singularity that spawned it, all we can say is: I don't know. Entropy was at an all time low then, perhaps zero, perhaps not quite zero.
I don't know.

One can speculate that perhaps the Universe's Energy was already present there in some quasi-zero entropy regime for an infinite time. If entropy was practically zero and changing nothing, then time would be standing still (following that definition of time I posted above), so "infinite time" is just the same as no time at all.

The function depicted bellow is an exponential:
[Image: img.gif]

This function, as you go to smaller and smaller infinities, always tends to zero, but never quite makes it.
Maybe the Universe's entropy was at this state of so close to zero you could smell it, but drifting very very slowly away from that zero.
At some threshold, the big bang occurred and that's when you see the curve going up, up, up, for ever up.
End speculation.

As you see, a completely naturalistic explanation is possible, even if unprovable.
So tell me again how a god is more probable than this quasi-zero entropy state of the Universe?
Reply



Messages In This Thread
The idea of God always existing - by Voltair - March 7, 2012 at 5:47 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by padraic - March 7, 2012 at 6:15 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Minimalist - March 7, 2012 at 6:48 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 10:25 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by IATIA - December 2, 2012 at 2:56 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Neo-Scholastic - March 7, 2012 at 6:51 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by michaelbest55 - November 29, 2012 at 5:40 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Cinjin - November 30, 2012 at 11:11 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Undeceived - November 30, 2012 at 3:41 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by genkaus - November 30, 2012 at 9:00 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Darkstar - November 30, 2012 at 10:44 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Undeceived - December 1, 2012 at 4:14 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Darkstar - December 2, 2012 at 12:39 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Undeceived - December 2, 2012 at 9:39 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Darkstar - December 2, 2012 at 10:04 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Undeceived - December 3, 2012 at 2:10 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by IATIA - December 3, 2012 at 2:43 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 3, 2012 at 7:36 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Undeceived - December 3, 2012 at 3:14 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 3, 2012 at 6:50 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Undeceived - December 4, 2012 at 1:59 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 4, 2012 at 6:40 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by downbeatplumb - December 6, 2012 at 2:25 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Kousbroek - December 2, 2012 at 7:41 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by genkaus - December 4, 2012 at 1:40 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Anomalocaris - March 7, 2012 at 6:51 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 7, 2012 at 6:55 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Anomalocaris - March 7, 2012 at 7:02 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 7, 2012 at 7:12 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Neo-Scholastic - March 7, 2012 at 7:06 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Anomalocaris - March 7, 2012 at 7:23 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 7, 2012 at 7:35 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Anomalocaris - March 7, 2012 at 8:07 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 7, 2012 at 8:49 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Neo-Scholastic - March 7, 2012 at 10:23 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by ThomM - March 7, 2012 at 10:33 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Voltair - March 7, 2012 at 11:15 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 8, 2012 at 12:45 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Skepsis - March 8, 2012 at 1:47 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Neo-Scholastic - March 7, 2012 at 11:48 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Voltair - March 7, 2012 at 11:54 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Neo-Scholastic - March 8, 2012 at 6:49 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by NoMoreFaith - March 8, 2012 at 6:54 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Neo-Scholastic - March 9, 2012 at 8:56 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 8, 2012 at 1:12 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Voltair - March 8, 2012 at 1:42 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 8, 2012 at 2:49 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by NoMoreFaith - March 8, 2012 at 6:33 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Voltair - March 8, 2012 at 2:54 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 8, 2012 at 2:58 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Ace Otana - March 8, 2012 at 8:05 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by MysticKnight - March 8, 2012 at 11:54 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by NoMoreFaith - March 8, 2012 at 1:12 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 8, 2012 at 12:21 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 8, 2012 at 12:31 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by picto90 - March 8, 2012 at 12:57 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 8, 2012 at 1:03 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by picto90 - March 8, 2012 at 1:08 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 8, 2012 at 1:16 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by picto90 - March 8, 2012 at 1:26 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 8, 2012 at 1:31 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Faith No More - March 8, 2012 at 3:06 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 8, 2012 at 10:14 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Voltair - March 9, 2012 at 2:08 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by toro - March 9, 2012 at 11:34 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Neo-Scholastic - March 10, 2012 at 12:19 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by toro - March 10, 2012 at 10:08 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 10:20 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 10:29 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 10:39 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 10:41 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 10:46 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 11:20 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 10:46 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 10:48 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 10:51 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 11:30 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 11:39 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 11:43 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 11:51 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 12:22 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 12:31 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Welsh cake - March 10, 2012 at 11:59 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 11:59 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 12:04 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 12:31 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 12:35 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 12:33 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 12:40 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 12:44 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Cinjin - March 10, 2012 at 12:40 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by frankiej - March 10, 2012 at 12:42 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 12:41 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 12:45 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 12:50 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by frankiej - March 10, 2012 at 12:48 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 12:51 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by frankiej - March 10, 2012 at 12:55 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 12:57 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 12:59 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Cinjin - March 10, 2012 at 12:59 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 1:13 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 1:16 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by frankiej - March 10, 2012 at 1:21 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 1:27 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 1:24 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 1:25 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 1:26 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 1:27 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by frankiej - March 10, 2012 at 1:27 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 1:28 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by black36 - March 10, 2012 at 1:28 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 1:40 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 1:35 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by frankiej - March 10, 2012 at 1:42 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Phil - March 10, 2012 at 1:45 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 1:44 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by frankiej - March 10, 2012 at 2:12 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 1:49 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by downbeatplumb - March 10, 2012 at 3:03 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 10, 2012 at 2:16 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Shell B - March 10, 2012 at 2:18 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Cinjin - March 10, 2012 at 3:31 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Shell B - March 10, 2012 at 3:34 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 8:26 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Shell B - March 10, 2012 at 8:30 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 8:32 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Shell B - March 10, 2012 at 8:33 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 10, 2012 at 8:35 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Shell B - March 11, 2012 at 1:18 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 11, 2012 at 10:44 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 11, 2012 at 11:29 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 11, 2012 at 1:20 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Shell B - March 11, 2012 at 1:22 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - March 11, 2012 at 1:20 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 11, 2012 at 1:23 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Shell B - March 11, 2012 at 1:30 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Werewolff - March 11, 2012 at 1:31 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by SaintGeorge - March 14, 2012 at 9:03 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Godschild - March 15, 2012 at 3:21 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by NoMoreFaith - March 15, 2012 at 7:04 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by ThomM - August 23, 2012 at 8:04 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Jackalope - August 23, 2012 at 8:16 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by festive1 - November 29, 2012 at 5:46 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by padraic - August 23, 2012 at 11:20 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Kayenneh - August 24, 2012 at 4:33 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Minimalist - November 29, 2012 at 5:51 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Cato - November 29, 2012 at 5:54 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Minimalist - November 29, 2012 at 5:59 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by John V - December 3, 2012 at 3:48 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Kousbroek - December 3, 2012 at 3:54 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by IATIA - December 4, 2012 at 9:12 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by The Grand Nudger - December 5, 2012 at 11:09 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Voltair - December 6, 2012 at 2:04 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Ryft - December 10, 2012 at 3:47 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Rayaan - December 10, 2012 at 4:15 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Ryft - December 10, 2012 at 4:40 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Welsh cake - December 10, 2012 at 4:29 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Rayaan - December 10, 2012 at 4:42 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by KichigaiNeko - December 10, 2012 at 4:51 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Tea Earl Grey Hot - December 11, 2012 at 1:44 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by ronedee - December 11, 2012 at 11:07 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Darkstar - December 11, 2012 at 12:04 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by ronedee - December 11, 2012 at 3:13 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 11, 2012 at 3:17 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Ryft - December 11, 2012 at 9:15 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 12, 2012 at 6:07 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Undeceived - December 12, 2012 at 11:37 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Dee Dee Ramone - December 12, 2012 at 11:48 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 13, 2012 at 6:12 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Ryft - December 13, 2012 at 11:43 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Darkstar - December 11, 2012 at 9:18 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Ryft - December 12, 2012 at 9:51 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Tea Earl Grey Hot - December 12, 2012 at 9:57 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Tea Earl Grey Hot - December 13, 2012 at 1:51 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Dee Dee Ramone - December 13, 2012 at 2:41 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 13, 2012 at 12:16 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by ronedee - December 13, 2012 at 3:45 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 14, 2012 at 12:10 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by ronedee - December 16, 2012 at 9:53 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 17, 2012 at 6:16 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Dee Dee Ramone - December 17, 2012 at 6:25 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 17, 2012 at 6:28 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Dee Dee Ramone - December 17, 2012 at 6:29 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by ronedee - December 17, 2012 at 12:19 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by downbeatplumb - December 17, 2012 at 2:43 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 17, 2012 at 4:51 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Faith No More - December 13, 2012 at 4:01 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by TarShoduze - December 17, 2012 at 6:51 am
RE: The idea of God always existing - by Faith No More - December 17, 2012 at 4:15 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by ronedee - December 18, 2012 at 4:09 pm
RE: The idea of God always existing - by pocaracas - December 18, 2012 at 4:33 pm

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