Universe from Nothing?

[Esquilax]

The Universe that we can measure and observe is one ruled by laws and order. The very smallest elements which we can study have ordered forms, and follow laws which allow us to predict many, though not all behaviors.

Order itself, law itself cannot exist on its own; it requires something of a higher order to give it. A legal universe requires God for its origin.

So, first of all, hello, welcome aboard, nice to have you and all. Perhaps you should consider making an introductions thread, since those go down well here.

Second of all, have you perhaps looked at the universe lately? The small portion of it that we can see is lethally cold, filled with radiation and debris that doesn't conform to any laws, and is often on fire, exploding, or exploding with radioactive fire. That is, those parts of it that aren't enormous, light-eating rents in the fabric of reality, or huge chunks of rock that can't support life, or whole galaxies on collision courses with each other. And that's me being generous, by leaving aside all the quantum weirdness that seems to subvert your cherished laws just as much as it adheres to them.

What part of this seems ordered, to you?

And even accepting your premise, why would that not just be a consequence of our ability to recognize patterns? What makes you think those patterns can't exist on their own? Why would a god that much more complex than those patterns not need a creator, when the patters do, by sheer dint of being complex?

It's not enough to just assert these things, newbie: justify them. Demonstrate them. Give us something real to sink our teeth into.