The justice and mercy of God

[znk666]

Well Hitler already was a devout catholic,so he wouldn't have to accept Jesus Christ.
I bet he'd get a VIP suite for killing all those Jewish people.

[Cinjin]

Well Hitler already was a devout catholic,so he wouldn't have to accept Jesus Christ.
I bet he'd get a VIP suite for killing all those Jewish people.

I'd say that's more than a fair assessment.

Actually, according to the bible, there's good odds that Hitler is among the chosen few glorified individuals. Even in suicide (which we can never truly know for sure if he killed himself or one of his own did it for him) many people ask forgiveness of both their loved ones and god. Being that Hitler did believe in god, it would be very likely that he did indeed ask forgiveness as he killed himself. He clearly believed that god had his back and probably felt that with a simple apology that god would overlook his one fault ... killing himself. (Most Catholics don't believe that suicide is forgivable, but everyone knows that their not really christians anyway as that dogma is not in the Bible anywhere.)

[Godscreated]

Godschild: Why should Hitler's victims have turned to Christ in the midst of the Holocaust? And anyway, what do you think of the doctrines of your faith that could allow the scenario where Jews are twice burnt and the one who exacted the murder of millions gets off scott free because he accepted Jesus Christ and they did not?

If the victims did not accept Jesus Christ, and they went to heaven anyway, on what basis is God allowing them entrance?

The Jews that died at Hitler's hand could possibly be in Heaven, there is a verse in the OT that says God will take care of those he uses for a purpose,it might take some time to find it if you would like me to. I think you should reword your first question, to answer it as stated would be the same reason anyone should respond to the saving grace of Christ. Besides we do not know if any of the Jews where christians. Hitler did not get off scott free, some here say that Hitler was a Catholic and he may have been, that however does not mean he was saved and the proof of that was the evil he did. People across the world claim to be christians, that does not make them christians. I could claim to be a biologist but that would not be true and you would soon find that I was not in having a conversation with me. There are mysteries to God will do not understand until we face Him.

[Minimalist]

God will take care of those he uses for a purpose

Well, then FUCK HIM.

[Zen Badger]

According to modern-day Pauline Christianity, a person is saved only if s/he accepts Jesus Christ as personal saviour. I asked the following questions in a Christian chat-room:

1) If an evil person sincerely asks for forgiveness and accepts Christ on their dying day, can they go to heaven? The answer was Yes.

2) In theory, if Hitler sincerely asked for forgiveness and accepted Christ on his dying day, he could have gone to heaven? The answer was Yes.

3) What about Hitler's victims, who were mostly Jews?
The majority's answer was: If they didn't accept Christ, they go to hell.

So, the murderer can go to heaven by accepting Jesus Christ, yet his victims go to hell for having a different opinion.


Is there any way to get Christians to see the total lack of reason and compassion in this line of thinking?

It's not an opinion, it is belief through faith. Hitler again, this is getting boring, Hitler would have never asked for forgiveness any man that was coward enough to take his life and not face the consequences of his actions is not going to humble himself before God to ask for forgiveness.

It doesn't matter whether Hitler asked for forgiveness or not.
The point is that he could've, and regardless of his monstrous crimes god would've welcomed him into heaven.
And his victims, whose only crime was to believe the "wrong" thing are condemned to hell for eternity.
And you think this is justice.

[Whateverist]

Is there any way to get Christians to see the total lack of reason and compassion in this line of thinking?

Not in my experience. The very, very rare Christian is agnostic and accepts that the bible was written imperfectly by men. The rest pretty much take their marching orders from that book. Christians who accept evolution and science as revealing the still unfolding 'creation' are much more common than the christian who will question the bible.

[Epimethean]

I love the bald statement that suicide is cowardice. This was not the case for the Samurai. Maybe it is only xtians who are cowardly when they commit suicide; hell, it seems to fit: Cowardice is their MO.

[Freedom]

The Jews that died at Hitler's hand could possibly be in Heaven, there is a verse in the OT that says God will take care of those he uses for a purpose,it might take some time to find it if you would like me to.

God allowed Hitler's victims to be gassed to death and incinerated for what purpose?

Hitler did not get off scott free, some here say that Hitler was a Catholic and he may have been, that however does not mean he was saved and the proof of that was the evil he did.

How do you know what became of Hitler? And according to your religion's teachings, it's not about what people do on earth; it's about accepting Jesus Christ as saviour.

There are mysteries to God will do not understand until we face Him.

In other words, you see the apparent cruelty of this deity and are too afraid to confront it.

[Erinome]

It never fails to make me a little nauseous when I see Christian ignorance and arrogance at play.

God works in mysterious ways!?! That's just a fucking cop out, and an excuse for your god, and an excuse for yourself for being backward and brainwashed enough to adhere to his amoral codes.

Why should the Jews have become Christian while the Christians were starving them, beating them, tossing their babies in the air and seeing how many bullets they could hit them with before they hit the ground? Every one of those men were Christian, and it doesn't matter that you declare them unchristian, because they believed they were, just as you believe, GC. If GC's god exists, most of those assholes are in paradise, while their Jewish victims burn in hell, and all because they didn't say the magic words before they died/didn't have the right kind of spiritual experience when they were praying to the same god- Yahweh.

That is so beyond fucked up... it's.. there are no words to describe how utterly disgusting that is, but if you're a true christian, you must believe that. It's in the bible, after all.

I am the way, the truth, and the life; NO MAN cometh unto the Father, BUT BY ME.

If Hitler, and his entire army of good Catholic soldiers believed that Christ was their savior, which they did, GC is going to be in heaven with all of them. I think I'd rather jump willingly into a lake of fire, or something.

[Minimalist]

Hitler did not get off scott free, some here say that Hitler was a Catholic and he may have been, that however does not mean he was saved and the proof of that was the evil he did.

How do you know what became of Hitler? And according to your religion's teachings, it's not about what people do on earth; it's about accepting Jesus Christ as saviour.

Here's what Hitler had to say on the subject of 'saviors.' Frankly, he sounds like exactly what G-C demands.

"My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.

-Adolf Hitler, in a speech on 12 April 1922 (Norman H. Baynes, ed. The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, April 1922-August 1939, Vol. 1 of 2, pp. 19-20, Oxford University Press, 1942)

Yup. They don't get much more 'xtian' than ole Adolf!