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RE: Obama care
August 6, 2012 at 1:55 pm
(This post was last modified: August 6, 2012 at 2:02 pm by Jaysyn.)
(July 29, 2012 at 2:00 pm)Creed of Heresy Wrote: I don't think the Founding Fathers even imagined something like a corporation could even exist and I'm pretty sure if they had there would be a lot of shit against them.
The "Founding Fathers" knew all about corporations, or at least their predecessors like the East Indian Company.
Here is a nice little essay about how they felt about them.
Thomas Jefferson Wrote:“I hope that we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country.”
Abraham Lincoln Wrote:“The money powers prey upon the nation in times of peace and conspire against it in times of adversity. The banking powers are more despotic than a monarchy, more insolent than autocracy, more selfish than bureaucracy. They denounce as public enemies all who question their methods or throw light upon their crimes. I have two great enemies, the Southern Army in front of me and the bankers in the rear. Of the two, the one at my rear is my greatest foe.
...
"How is it that a lame man does not annoy us while a lame mind does? Because a lame man recognizes that we are walking straight, while a lame mind says that it is we who are limping." - Pascal
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RE: Obama care
August 6, 2012 at 1:57 pm
Capitalism has been ruining lives since the roman empire.
You can fix ignorance, you can't fix stupid.
Tinkety Tonk and down with the Nazis.
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RE: Obama care
August 6, 2012 at 2:11 pm
(August 6, 2012 at 1:57 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: Capitalism has been ruining lives since the roman empire.
I'd like to paraphrase what Winston Churchill once observed about Democracy:
Capitalism is the worst system of economics except for all the others.
That's why I believe in regulated capitalism.
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RE: Obama care
August 6, 2012 at 2:18 pm
(This post was last modified: August 6, 2012 at 2:21 pm by Whateverist.)
(August 6, 2012 at 1:13 pm)A Theist Wrote: (August 6, 2012 at 12:49 pm)whateverist Wrote: Bachmann's talk of "2nd amendment solutions" has made such offhand remarks by the right wing a sore point with this liberal too. All the while the hypocrisy and the double standards from the leftwing excuses their own offhanded remarks of hate and vitriol against conservatives in the name of tolerance.
What the hell are you talking about? Hate and vitriol are republican planks. Just because liberal politics fill you and your ilk with hate and vitriol does not mean it was sent your way by liberals. Pull your head from your ass and try that thought again.
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RE: Obama care
August 6, 2012 at 10:30 pm
Perhaps some kind person will explain to me the relevance of the views and intentions of the founding fathers of the USA.
Abraham Lincoln described the US Republic as having a government "of the people, for the people and by the people" The US constitution was deliberately designed so it could be changed at the will of "we the the people"
The constitution was adopted in 1787. Since that time there have been 27 amendments ,the first enacted in 1791, the last in 1991. The first ten amendments were ALL proposed at the same time; September 25 1789 and were all enacted on December 15 1791.
The founding fathers set up a framework, not a binding dogma.Even the justification for the loopy US gun culture,the Second Amendment may be simply abolished at any time by' we the people',and will be, eventually.
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RE: Obama care
August 6, 2012 at 10:35 pm
(August 6, 2012 at 10:30 pm)padraic Wrote: Perhaps some kind person will explain to me the relevance of the views and intentions of the founding fathers of the USA.
It's an American thing.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
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RE: Obama care
August 7, 2012 at 6:07 am
(August 6, 2012 at 10:30 pm)padraic Wrote: Perhaps some kind person will explain to me the relevance of the views and intentions of the founding fathers of the USA.
Abraham Lincoln described the US Republic as having a government "of the people, for the people and by the people" The US constitution was deliberately designed so it could be changed at the will of "we the the people"
The constitution was adopted in 1787. Since that time there have been 27 amendments ,the first enacted in 1791, the last in 1991. The first ten amendments were ALL proposed at the same time; September 25 1789 and were all enacted on December 15 1791.
The founding fathers set up a framework, not a binding dogma.Even the justification for the loopy US gun culture,the Second Amendment may be simply abolished at any time by' we the people',and will be, eventually.
1.) They are rather revered in the USA.
2.) Neo-conservatives & christian dominionists use them as talking point, i.e. "this is what the founding fathers wanted, what they worshiped & how they lived", even if it is a blatant lie revealed by actually reading the things that said founding fathers wrote.
3.) The 2nd Amendment isn't going anywhere in mine or your lifetime. You simply have no idea how ingrained firearm ownership is over here.
"How is it that a lame man does not annoy us while a lame mind does? Because a lame man recognizes that we are walking straight, while a lame mind says that it is we who are limping." - Pascal
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RE: Obama care
August 7, 2012 at 6:14 am
Hey, I own several guns. There a problem with that? Europeans live by this amusing mindset that if you take away the guns you'll take away the violence. I, however, on the other hand, say that if everyone has a gun, the threat of a burglar or robber stealing your shit is going to be much lower if potentially every individual could shoot them dead if they tried something. Same with rapists
A polite society is an armed society. When you let only the government have the guns, what exactly do you think will eventually end up happening if the wrong people get put into power?
The second amendment will never go away.
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RE: Obama care
August 7, 2012 at 8:10 am
(This post was last modified: August 7, 2012 at 8:14 am by Darth.)
(August 7, 2012 at 6:14 am)Creed of Heresy Wrote: Hey, I own several guns. There a problem with that? Europeans live by this amusing mindset that if you take away the guns you'll take away the violence. I, however, on the other hand, say that if everyone has a gun, the threat of a burglar or robber stealing your shit is going to be much lower if potentially every individual could shoot them dead if they tried something. Same with rapists
A polite society is an armed society. When you let only the government have the guns, what exactly do you think will eventually end up happening if the wrong people get put into power?
The second amendment will never go away.
I'm not so optimistic, I think they will try, look at how the other ones have been treated.
4, 5 ,6 ,8, 10, the exception to 13 is applied to millions, even the first amendment is ignored.
What makes you think that the second is safe, especially given what they tried in D.C?
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RE: Obama care
August 7, 2012 at 9:06 am
(August 7, 2012 at 8:10 am)Stue Denim Wrote: I'm not so optimistic, I think they will try, look at how the other ones have been treated.
4, 5 ,6 ,8, 10, the exception to 13 is applied to millions, even the first amendment is ignored.
What makes you think that the second is safe, especially given what they tried in D.C?
Because none of the other amendments you mentioned have such a powerful lobby as the NRA working for them.
Until paid political advertisement is banned, money will always have its way in DC. 
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
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