Mary's 10 Year Pregnancy!

[Bad Wolf]

No, it’s supported and well known, 42 authors mention Jesus while only 10 mention Tiberius. That’s over four times as many.

I think he wanted you to provide links, you know evidence and such.

No, I reject the scientific majority opinion (not consensus)

You are lying, to put it plainly. There is no doubt in the scientific community that evolution is the best theory that explains the diversity of life.

Truth reported 24,000 times.

That isn't a rebuttal

Yes we are. I see no reason to take Christian stories about Jesus any more seriously than I take ancient Greek stories about Hercules.

“I see no reason to accept that the Holocaust really happened over the killing of Ewoks in the Return of the Jedi”

Absurdity at its finest.

Not exactly a great comparison seeing as we have evidence that the holocaust happened. 6 million jews don't just disappear into thin air. Also we have evidence that 'The Return of the Jedi' was a fictional movie.

I’ve seen your videos, I know you’re fully aware of the evidence for Jesus; you merely dismiss it upon irrational grounds. I cannot help you there.

I think it would help everyone out here if you explained how he's being irrational. And I didn't think jesus was mentioned anywhere outside the bible, but then again i don't study history much.

There’s no proof that any historical figure existed.

We'll we know that JFK existed, we did see him get shot on TV

You hate Christianity so therefore Jesus never really existed.

If only it were that simple

No blood on these hands old timer.

Look up 'The Crusades' I think thats quite a lot of blood

[Minimalist]

Hey, Waldork you dumb fuck. You do know...or should be told that your xtian thugs burned the libraries of antiquity but, thanks to Origen we do have a small sampling of some of the comments by Greco-Roman writers like Celsus - the work is Contra Celsus - to see what they thought of your early shithead brethren.

Chap. 28

...[Celsus] accuses [Jesus] of having "invented his birth from a virgin," and upbraids Him with being "born in a certain Jewish village, of a poor woman of the country, who gained her subsistence by spinning, and who was turned out of doors by her husband, a carpenter by trade, because she was convicted of adultery; that after being driven away by her husband, and wandering about for a time, she disgracefully gave birth to Jesus, an illegitimate child, who having hired himself out as a servant in Egypt on account of his poverty, and having there acquired some miraculous powers, on which the Egyptians greatly pride themselves, returned to his own country, highly elated on account of them, and by means of these proclaimed himself a God."...

BOOK 3

Chap. 44

After these points Celsus quotes some objections against the doctrine of Jesus, made by a very few individuals who are considered Christians, not of the more intelligent, as he supposes, but of the more ignorant class, and asserts that "the following are the rules laid down by them. Let no one come to us who has been instructed, or who is wise or prudent (for such qualifications are deemed evil by us); but if there be any ignorant, or unintelligent, or uninstructed, or foolish persons, let them come with confidence. By which words, acknowledging that such individuals are worthy of their God, they manifestly show that they desire and are able to gain over only the silly, and the mean, and the stupid, with women and children."...

I must admit...Celsus nailed your sorry ass in Chapter 44.

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Look up 'The Crusades' I think thats quite a lot of blood

He's a protestant fuckwad. You have to go to the witch trials, the 30 years war and the wars of the reformation, etc for their atrocities.

[Simon Moon]

No, it’s supported and well known, 42 authors mention Jesus while only 10 mention Tiberius. That’s over four times as many.

The 10/42 claim has been thoroughly shot down.

I won't even go into the 42 number attributed to authors that mention Jesus, some of them are highly disputed. I mean, please, Josephus is included in the 42.

But they got the 10 mentions for Tiberius incorrect by a factor of 10. oops...

The list given in 10/42 argument for the authors that mention Tiberius are:

“Josephus, Tacitus, Suetonius, Seneca, Paterculus, Plutarch, Pliny the Elder, Strabo, Valerius Maximus, and Luke.”

Well, it looks like the list was a bit short. There are actually 44 authors that mention Tiberius, including Tiberius himself.

"The contemporary poet Horace (writing c. 21 BCE) mentions Tiberius multiple times and even writes to a military friend campaigning with Tiberius in the 3rd letter of book 1 of his Epistles. Another contemporary, Cornelius Nepos , also mentions Tiberius’ first marriage in his Life of Atticus. The poet Ovid (c. 13 CE) discusses Tiberius’ triumph in book 2 of his Epistulae Ex Ponto. Livy’s history of Rome, though the books dealing with the time of Tiberius are lost, still have book summaries preserved in later Periochae . A number of the later books, such as 138 dealing with Tiberius’ military campaigns under Augustus, provide yet another contemporary source for Tiberius. Seneca is mentioned (presumably the Younger) on their list, but a reference survives to the contemporary Seneca the Elder’s (c. 39 CE) lost historical work in Sutonius’ Life of Tiberius where the Elder Seneca writes about Tiberius’ death. Philo of Alexandria (c. 39 CE) mentions Tiberius’s recent death multiple times in his Embassy to Gaius."

"Phaedrus (c. 45 CE), who wrote Latin versions of Aesop’s fables, likewise writes a humorous tale about Tiberius and an attendant in his Aesopica. Columella (c. 65 CE) in book 11 of his De Re Rustica mentions Tiberius, as does Quintilian (95 CE) in book 3 of his Institutio Oratoria. Frontinus (c. 100 CE) makes an obscure, but nevertheless solid reference to Tiberius in book 1 of his On the Water Supply of Rome."

"There are a number of authors that this apologetic counts for Jesus, but fails to mention also wrote about Tiberius! The apologetic counts Pliny the Younger’s dubious reference to a “Christ,” but fail to mention that the Younger Pliny clearly mentions Tiberius in Book 5 of his Epistles in his letter to Titius Aristo. Lucian is listed as a source for Jesus, but it is ignored that he mentions Tiberius in his Macrobii. The apologetic even misses important Christian sources that mention Tiberius. Justin the Martyr is counted for Jesus, but it is not pointed out that he also mentions Tiberius in his First Apology. Likewise, Theophilus of Antioch is counted for Jesus, but his reference to Tiberius in book 3 of To Autolycus is not included. The apologetic even fails to connect the dots when Phlegon and Thallus are counted as sources for Jesus, because they mention an eclipse during the reign of Tiberius, that these references include Tiberius Caesar! So the apologetic is not even checking its own sources! Phlegon likewise records in book 13 of his On Marvels that Apollonius the Grammarian wrote about Tiberius, which is also not included."

"What about Tiberius himself? Unlike Jesus, Tiberius was certainly literate and a number of his letters are preserved in fragments within the works of both Tacitus and Suetonius. In addition, Suetonius even makes clear in his Life of Tiberius that Tiberius wrote memoirs that he used when constructing his biography (61.1). Thus, Tiberius himself also counts as a source for his own life and existence. How about Tiberius’ stepfather Augustus? Suetonius likewise quotes a number of letters written by Augustus addressed to Tiberius, which likewise count as sources for Tiberius’ life. How about Tiberius’ nephew Germanicus? A little known poem, the Aratus, survives written by Germanicus that he dedicates to his adopted father [Tiberius]. A speech of Tiberius’ other nephew, the emperor Claudius, is likewise recorded in Tacitus and preserved on the bronze Lyon Tablet that mentions Tiberius. Thus, within Tiberius’ own family we have Augustus, Germanicus, and Claudius as sources for him, in addition to Tiberius himself."

Here's the complete article.10/42 Destroyed

The 10/42 might be a new low in apologetics.

[Beta Ray Bill]

Waldorf, I know of a few historical quotes that can be applied to you quite well:

Seneca the Younger - "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."

Buddha - “We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world.”

Socrates - "Ordinary people seem not to realize that those who really apply themselves in the right way to philosophy are directly and of their own accord preparing themselves for dying and death."

I don't know what my destiny is, but I'm not incorrectly applying it to ancient speculations. I am living and will die by my own accord, and not put all my faith in one of a million religions.

[Minimalist]

You can not impress Waldork with facts. He is a flaming asshole who believes in a talking snake and a 6,000 year old universe for fuck's sake.

Just shit on him. It's all he deserves.

[Drich]

Thus requiring the priest to have her checked.

Sounds invasive and slightly pornographic. Are you sure the priest checked her out?

I said "Requiring the Priest to have her checked." It's in the above post you quoted.

I did not say 'requiring the preist to check himself.'

What I said leave room for the priest to have check but also to have someone check and report back to him.

[Rev. Rye]

OK, so, let's review. Mary conceived prior to 4 BC and gave birth after 6 AD.

It's a 10 year pregnancy!

It's a miracle! ...or something.

You know, I recently read a Naruto Fanfic where Sakura gave birth twice after pregnancies that lasted, at most, a single month, and, in both cases, the children were in their teens within, at most, a day after being born. Seriously, a 10-year pregnancy is at least a step up.

[Drich]

Now they go to get married. Where do the have to go to get married? The Temple.

You mentioned earlier the verses 20-25. Verse 24 tells us that Joseph "took Mary home as his wife." Is there anything in the Bible that indicates that couples were to be wed in the temple, or that this custom was followed in Jesus' time?

In Jesus time up untill his death, they were under OT law. which means Joseph and Mary Had to follow OT law at the time they were married. To be Married they had to go before God and make their vows. In order to do this one needed a Rabbi or Priest to sanction said vows.

[Minimalist]

Are you sure you aren't a sock puppet for "archaeologist," Drippy. Because you sound as stupid as him.

People did NOT journey from all over Judaea to get married in the fucking temple. This is an invention of yours. I know you make shit up all the time but really this time you have outdone yourself.

http://www.bible.ca/marriage/ancient-jew...-bible.htm

There was no "wedding ceremony" in the synagogue in the first century, performed under a canopy where the bride and groom would hold hands and say, "I do" before an audience of friends and family. This didn’t develop for hundreds of years after Jesus died on the cross as the Passover lamb for the sins of mankind.

BTW, this is a xtian site which explains the bullshit about jesus dying on some cross for some alleged sins.

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I appearently made a mistake. where I said Herod ruled Galalee I was wrong. He ruled over Judea, that is why Christ grew up in galalee.

You have made so many I stopped counting ages ago.

[Tonus]

I guess one of the perks of being a temple priest at the time was that you'd get to finger every virgin bride.