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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 4:54 pm
(This post was last modified: July 10, 2015 at 4:55 pm by Godscreated.)
I've seen recently that this generation that's growing up has a life expectancy less than that of their parents, if it happens will be first time this has happened over at least a few hundred years. I voted no there's be enough killing of the innocent already.
GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 4:57 pm
Quote:The bible is not the doctrine of my faith. The doctrine of my faith teaches that women and men are equals.
You're not a very good catholic then. Careful. Randy may not talk to you any more.
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 4:58 pm
Sorry GC, but how is that relevant to the topic? 
And could you get me a link for that pls?
I can find studies that show life expectancy rising and ones that show it's slightly falling, but not what you mentioned
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 4:59 pm
(July 10, 2015 at 4:57 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Quote:The bible is not the doctrine of my faith. The doctrine of my faith teaches that women and men are equals.
You're not a very good catholic then. Careful. Randy may not talk to you any more.
The bible is not Church doctrine. This is fact. Randy knows this and has never and would never say otherwise. 
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 5:06 pm
(July 10, 2015 at 4:46 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: (July 10, 2015 at 4:44 pm)AFTT47 Wrote: I voted other.
It would be undesirable to be sure but I wouldn't take it off the table. Overpopulation is a really frightening thing. Combat it other ways first but if it gets bad enough, government oversight would be preferable to letting it spiral out of control.
The Catholic Church by the way is, one of the prominent villains here. Maybe Pope Francis will figure out that opposing birth control and encouraging the flock to mindlessly reproduce is incompatible with his laudable stance that we should take better care of the planet.
Having the opinion that contraception is not moral does not mean we support mindless reproduction, btw. :
If everyone followed the Church teaching to save sex for marriage, there would be a lot less pregnancies. Also, the Church does encourage responsible family planning by fertility monitoring.
You may not agree with either of these things, but saying we advocate for "mindless reproduction" is simply inaccurate.
Everyone following the church's teachings about sex before marriage is SO not going to happen. Ten percent is SO not going to happen so the practical matter is that the stupid anti-birth control stance results in unwanted pregnancies. Just look at the rate of single, teen mothers in Catholic countries vs. non-Catholic. Look at how successful GWB's idiotic abstinence-only sex education has worked.
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 5:18 pm
I salute China for getting a grip on their population growth back at a time when there would surely have been mass starvation otherwise. I doubt we could do that or much of anything else which depends on political accord. Republicans have made absolutely every issue a political one.
I would be extremely happy to see population shrink by half, but I'm not a fan of coercion.
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 5:23 pm
(July 10, 2015 at 4:59 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: (July 10, 2015 at 4:57 pm)Minimalist Wrote: You're not a very good catholic then. Careful. Randy may not talk to you any more.
The bible is not Church doctrine. This is fact. Randy knows this and has never and would never say otherwise.
So you reject the bible?
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 5:42 pm
I don't think that the government should use coercion but I think that tax incentives for those who have less than two children would work Free birth control and a comprehensive sex ed program would help also.
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 5:52 pm
I don't play on that side of the street, so, I'd posit my views don't matter near as much as the views of the breeders do.
Having said that, if it was up to me, people would need a permit to reproduce. And yes, I'd have a shit load of regulations and hoops for the prospective parents to jump through. I also realize that regulating it is futile until we can regulate everyone everywhere.
Bwa, ha, ha, ha !!!! Infibulation for women AND mens !!!!
The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it.
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RE: government controlling/monitoring child bearing
July 10, 2015 at 6:08 pm
(This post was last modified: July 10, 2015 at 6:39 pm by Catholic_Lady.)
(July 10, 2015 at 5:06 pm)AFTT47 Wrote: (July 10, 2015 at 4:46 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Having the opinion that contraception is not moral does not mean we support mindless reproduction, btw. :
If everyone followed the Church teaching to save sex for marriage, there would be a lot less pregnancies. Also, the Church does encourage responsible family planning by fertility monitoring.
You may not agree with either of these things, but saying we advocate for "mindless reproduction" is simply inaccurate.
Everyone following the church's teachings about sex before marriage is SO not going to happen. Ten percent is SO not going to happen so the practical matter is that the stupid anti-birth control stance results in unwanted pregnancies. Just look at the rate of single, teen mothers in Catholic countries vs. non-Catholic. Look at how successful GWB's idiotic abstinence-only sex education has worked.
The point is the Church does not advocate for "mindless reproduction", like you said lol.
The Church advocates for saving sex for marriage, and for responsible family planning through the means of fertility monitoring. To say the Church advocates for mindless reproduction is wrong.
(btw, the "Catholic countries" you speak of are in Central and South America, which are mostly 3rd world and poor. This would explain why the pregnancy rate is higher. I am Brazilian (living in the US) and I can tell you that the public schools there do not implement abstinence only programs lol.)
(July 10, 2015 at 5:23 pm)Minimalist Wrote: (July 10, 2015 at 4:59 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: The bible is not Church doctrine. This is fact. Randy knows this and has never and would never say otherwise.
So you reject the bible?
I am rejecting the bible as doctrine, yes. I am Catholic. Catholicism is not sola scriptura and does not hold the bible as an infallible church document. Just because the bible may say something, doesn't mean that thing is doctrine to us Catholics.
Edit to add: This does not mean I don't think the bible is important or that it isn't an inspired work. It just means that as a Catholic, I don't take every single phrase in the bible as Doctrinal Truth. The point you brought up, for example, about "women being the source of evil in the world" is not Church doctrine or Church teaching of any kind lol. Jesus being divine, on the other hand, is Church doctrine. I hope that helps clear it up!
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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