Mock dialogue of the Theist/Atheist discussion here.

[drfuzzy]

If god is proven by Aristotle why are you here giving us countless piss poor attempts at arguments for the existence of god?

If one medication doesn't work on a patient, you try another?

If you consider us to be your "patients" in need of healing, correction, and wisdom . . . fuck off.  The entire mindset is disrespectful and insulting to us.

Post #4  -  "There has to be another way".  "we won't reach conclusion of it this way."

We won't reach conclusion at all.  You believe in god, and you're on an atheist website.  We don't believe in god.  Why is that so hard to understand?  Have Allah show up himself and say hello, then we might change our minds.  Maybe.  But our beliefs are none of your business.

[drfuzzy]

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Isn't it interesting that you chose the most flattering depictions for your theists, and the most unflattering for your atheists?

That's pretty sneaky.  Perhaps rather than depict all atheists as rude cretins and all theists as angelic victims of atheist aggression, a more realistic set of caricatures would get your point across better. Right now you seem to be assigning blame to those horrible rude atheists, and giving your beatific theist brethren a pass.  I'm not interested in discussing unbalanced and therefore unrealistic portrayls; I just wanted to point out the bias in your original post; it renders that post useless, to my mind.  

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 Theist1 was suppose to me when I first came here. I use to say I believe for reasons that I can only justify to myself and can't prove God. I even had a thread once saying "all logic tells me God doesn't exist but my heart says otherwise".

Theist2 is me having a little courage to find arguments and believe in them and present them. 

Theist3 is me coming to religion.

I said Theist but I really meant me. The theist/atheist dialogue phases I been through.

But you are right, if it was a general implication, then it's unfair...a lot Theists here come with not much to dialogue and are rude.

But in all honesty.......I want a sincere dialogue over this issue. And my impression, is over all been this. 

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Sorry . . . double post . . . don't know how that happened.

[drfuzzy]

You left out the 3rd idiot (I don't think atheists or theists are idiots, but mystic sure is)

MysticKnight: "I am so smart, I know I picked the right religion because my book says so, i deserve a cookie....mmmm so halal"

You don't realize it but people like you make Theists think badly of Atheists. If over all you guys would give a sincere humble compassionate approach, you would be respected more by Theists. I know some Atheists in real life, and they are not like this at all, so I don't think Atheists are the type to always throw insults.  In fact I've witnessed some of the more compassionate caring types and understanding to be Atheists.

But this attitude has to go for that to happen online too. If a Theist wonders how Atheists are like and he sees insults and what not, that's going to give him an impression. If the most person to be given kudos on the site is a person with most toxic attitude towards Theists, then what do you expect Theists to think? You want to mock and insult, that's up to you. It's your choice. But it makes you look weaker and not stronger.

Yes the Theist coming online shouldn't generalize his experience to people in general in real life, but it will happen.

If more people were like Whateverist here or Tiberius (and I can mention many more good names), then people would have a very good impression.

I know people say "Atheism" doesn't play any role in how the person acts because it simply is a lack of belief in God, but that's not how its going to give an impression and seem like to most people coming online to these forums.

Theists that come into OUR house, to try to change our poor deluded minds and save our poor deluded souls, are what make atheists respond to those pathetic, infantile, egotistical, disrespectful behaviors with scorn.  We're fine with theists until they try to preach.  Then the gloves NEED to come off.
Whenever a believer tries to prove to us that god exists, they are calling us STUPID.  When we say that we don't accept their reasons, they throw a temper tantrum.  
    Why?  Because they think that what we believe is their business.  Because they think that as soon as they present their brilliant arguments, we will automatically "see the light" and agree with them.  Then their beliefs will be vindicated.
   It doesn't work that way.  It will most likely never work that way.
   So why do we need to read more of your arguments and give them oh-so-proper worshipful acceptance, again?  Why are you here?

[Mr.wizard]

You left out the 3rd idiot (I don't think atheists or theists are idiots, but mystic sure is)

MysticKnight: "I am so smart, I know I picked the right religion because my book says so, i deserve a cookie....mmmm so halal"

You don't realize it but people like you make Theists think badly of Atheists. If over all you guys would give a sincere humble compassionate approach, you would be respected more by Theists. I know some Atheists in real life, and they are not like this at all, so I don't think Atheists are the type to always throw insults.  In fact I've witnessed some of the more compassionate caring types and understanding to be Atheists.

But this attitude has to go for that to happen online too. If a Theist wonders how Atheists are like and he sees insults and what not, that's going to give him an impression. If the most person to be given kudos on the site is a person with most toxic attitude towards Theists, then what do you expect Theists to think? You want to mock and insult, that's up to you. It's your choice. But it makes you look weaker and not stronger.

Yes the Theist coming online shouldn't generalize his experience to people in general in real life, but it will happen.

If more people were like Whateverist here or Tiberius (and I can mention many more good names), then people would have a very good impression.

I know people say "Atheism" doesn't play any role in how the person acts because it simply is a lack of belief in God, but that's not how its going to give an impression and seem like to most people coming online to these forums.

Oh screw your impressions of atheists, go cry somewhere else.

[Simon Moon]

What did you expect, MK?  People have been failing for centuries to provide a good argument for god.  Did you think that you could come up with something new?

I believe Aristotle proves God and his divinity and ultimate uniqueness. I think it's been proven for a long time.

I also find Richard Dawkins refutations of Aristotle hilarious to say nothing more.

Even if Aristotle's arguments weren't flawed (Hume demonstrated they are), a philosophical argument alone is not enough to prove the existence of a god.

You can dance around it as much as you want, but when it comes to existential claims, demonstrable and falsifiable evidence is required, if you want to convince those of us that actually understand what good evidence is.

[Mystic]

Jenny A

How it exists isn't really a useful question unless we have some means of answering it.

It's useful question because we do have the means of answering it. I'm asking about your objective value. Not the weight of your body but the value of your self.

How is it possible it exists? Do you know it exists? And how do you know it exists if so? And if not, why you think people believe they have objective value?

Remember your perception of yourself is not what gives it objective value because as you said it's value is there regardless of what we think it to be.

[Mr.wizard]

Jenny A

How it exists isn't really a useful question unless we have some means of answering it.

It's useful question because we do have the means of answering it. I'm asking about your objective value. Not the weight of your body but the value of your self.

How is it possible it exists? Do you know it exists? And how do you know it exists if so? And if not, why you think people believe they have objective value?

Remember your perception of yourself is not what gives it objective value because as you said it's value is there regardless of what think it to be.

What is a persons "objective value"?

[Mystic]

Jenny A


It's useful question because we do have the means of answering it. I'm asking about your objective value. Not the weight of your body but the value of your self.

How is it possible it exists? Do you know it exists? And how do you know it exists if so? And if not, why you think people believe they have objective value?

Remember your perception of yourself is not what gives it objective value because as you said it's value is there regardless of what think it to be.

What is a persons "objective value"?

If I answer it people will say I am asserting non-sense. So let you answer it.

What is a person's objective value? How does it exist? Do you know it exists? If not, why do you think people assume it exists?

And remember your perception of yourself Jenny A and I agreed is not what determines objective value.

[Jenny A]

Jenny A

How it exists isn't really a useful question unless we have some means of answering it.

It's useful question because we do have the means of answering it. I'm asking about your objective value. Not the weight of your body but the value of your self.

How is it possible it exists? Do you know it exists? And how do you know it exists if so? And if not, why you think people believe they have objective value?

Remember your perception of yourself is not what gives it objective value because as you said it's value is there regardless of what think it to be.

I don't have objective value. That my thought processes exist is objectively verifiable. You are reading proof of their existence in the form of out put. But they have no objective value. Objective value is an oxymoron. Value, unlike weight is inherently subjective.

[Mr.wizard]

What is a persons "objective value"?

If I answer it people will say I am asserting non-sense. So let you answer it.

What is a person's objective value? How does it exist? Do you know it exists? If not, why do you think people assume it exists?

And remember your perception of yourself Jenny A and I agreed is not what determines objective value.

How are you measuring this value?