If Life is Meaningless Anyway, then What's Wrong with Religion?

[Excited Penguin]

LFC, don't you feel like it's none of our business what she does with her own life? I mean she sounds like a private enough person as it is. Let her be.

She's just offering advice...

So am I, FAF... So am I.

[LadyForCamus]

Perhaps companionship is one of those things that you don't recognize you are missing until you have it, and it's taken away.  Being a stay-at home-mom (and an introvert) can be isolating at times and I've noticed that the less I see people, the less I want to see people, but ultimately I feel worse.  Maybe it would be helpful for you to try out one of those book clubs you were talking about again.  Or maybe there is an 'Atheists Meet' type of IRL group in your area that you could engage in?

LFC, don't you feel like it's none of our business what she does with her own life? I mean she sounds like a private enough person as it is. Let her be.

Oh boy, somebody's in The Mood! Got the itch this morning, do you, EP? Did SteelCurtain get you going over pho in the other thread? I'm not scratching it for you bud, sorry. Pick a fight with someone else today.

Jor offered us a rare glimpse at some personal, and intimate feelings she has regarding he own life. What a nice moment of opening up on her part! I politely asked her some more questions because 1. I don't like to see people sad, and 2. I enjoy being a good listener. Jor is an autonomous adult. If she doesn't feel comfortable going any further in the conversation she can say so, and of course I would respect that.

There is nothing to argue about here, EP. You are manufacturing drama. Now, move along. Or take a nap and come back when The Bug has crawled back out of your asshole. [emoji846]

[LadyForCamus]

Double post.

[Excited Penguin]

LFC, don't you feel like it's none of our business what she does with her own life? I mean she sounds like a private enough person as it is. Let her be.

Oh boy, somebody's in The Mood!  Got the itch this morning, do you, EP?   Did SteelCurtain get you going over pho in the other thread?  I'm not scratching it for you bud, sorry.  Pick a fight with someone else today.  

Jor offered us a rare glimpse at some personal, and intimate feelings she has regarding he own life.  What a nice moment of opening up on her part!  I politely asked her some more questions because 1. I don't like to see people sad, and 2. I enjoy being a good listener.  Jor is an autonomous adult.  If she doesn't feel comfortable going any further in the conversation she can say so, and of course I would respect that.

There is nothing to argue about here, EP.  You are manufacturing drama.  Now, move along.  Or take a nap and come back when The Bug has crawled back out of your asshole.  [emoji846]

Wow, ok.

[The Grand Nudger]

  And if life is meaningless anyway, then why does it matter whether a person's sense of meaning is based on fact or fiction?

For all of the same reasons that it would matter -regardless- of whether or not a persons sense of meaning is based on fact or fiction, and regardless of whether or not that meaning is objective or subjective.

Or not.

If, for example..you think it matters whether or not a person is compelled to human sacrifice......it doesn't matter whether or not there is meaning to life, objective or subjective...or whether or not this persons compelling interest is fact or fiction.  You either think that this makes whatever they take their sense of meaning from to be abhorrent, or you do not.  I don't see why, in the op q, one question is thought to be relevant with regards to an appraisal of the other (or that the secondary questions are, themselves, representative of what we are attempting to explore with their use). I know, I know, we say that there's no such thing as a bad question.....but that's not really true, lol.

[Mister Agenda]

What prevents you from establishing your own meaning?

If the truth is that life is meaningless, then any meaning I assign to life is going to be fictional.  So if I do establish my own fictional meaning in life (and it will inevitably be fictional) then why is that more noble and enlightened than someone whose meaning comes from a fictional traditional religion, like Islam or Christianity?

---

How did you establish that life is meaningless, and that someone finding their own meaning is a fiction?

It seems to me that something can only mean something to someone. You're someone. Life can have meaning for you. It doesn't necessarily have to be the same meaning that others find. There's nothing about the word 'meaning' to indicate that it should be considered anything but subjective, the idea of an 'objective meaning' is self contradictory.

People don't have a purpose like a hammer has a purpose. That doesn't mean a person can't have purpose.

[Mister Agenda]

I'll go through an example of finding meaning in a secular accomplishment as a religious person.  

I've got a couple of publications out there from my research.  What is the meaning of those publications?  As a Mormon, I would have said that they were meaningful because the prepared the way for God's kingdom to return to Earth, and because they were resume bullet points that would help me in my life, which meant finding a job and attracting a woman.  The selfish meaning for those publications, which I just mentioned, were important because I was going to live forever and I needed to get started on it, so I needed a job, and if I was going to have an eternal wife I'd better be with someone I wanted to be with, so it was important to make myself appealing.  That would have been the meaning.  

Now I'm not sure what the meaning of those publications is.  So some people are enlightened by them, but so what?  If we're all doomed anyway, then what is the meaning of my publications?

Why read a book or watch a movie when you know they're going to end?

A book or movie that never ends, is never complete. I can't think of anything more pointless than my earthly existence being a mere prelude to eternal existence, the part of my life where I was born, grew up, did things on this earth and finally died becoming a smaller and smaller part of who I am, century after millennia after eon. I wouldn't mind a longer, healthier life; but it has to end sometime.

[Full Circle]

Only after I discarded the trappings of religion did my life become truly meaningful. It gained a sense of urgency. Once you come to grips that there is no “do over” you realize that loving and caring here and now is everything. 

Those small gestures of kindness, sympathy and empathy take on a much greater and deeper meaning. Helping your neighbor, friend, family member move their stuff across town for example is the highest calling. Making other people’s lives a bit easier has more meaning as an atheist than to those who subscribe that a god will reward them in an afterlife. 

I don’t pass up the chance to help and serve others and this gives my life a deep sense of meaning. I also contribute to the knowledge base of understanding with marine research, adding to the scientific library for others to use gives me great satisfaction, it is something greater than myself. Find what that is for you and embrace it.

[Mister Agenda]

I guess in the end what matters is what we made of the brief shot at existence we got. Nothing I do will matter in ten billion years...but I think THAT is what really doesn't matter. The things that matter to me matter right now.

[Huggy Bear]

I don't think you guys get what the OP is saying. He's not talking about what you personally feel is important, I believe he's talking about your place in the overall cosmos.

We recognize that in nature all creatures / organisms are important to their environment which is why we refer to it as a system, everything has its role to play in the overall scheme of things; everything except humans.