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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:07 pm
(This post was last modified: November 6, 2017 at 3:07 pm by Catholic_Lady.)
Vor, steve said conception, not successful birth.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:09 pm
(This post was last modified: November 6, 2017 at 3:10 pm by Harry Nevis.)
(November 6, 2017 at 1:39 pm)alpha male Wrote: (November 6, 2017 at 1:23 pm)possibletarian Wrote: Seriously ? you don't think that torturing people that you are responsible for creating in the first place is not insane ?
No. You previously allowed free will, but now you're attempting to shift the fault from people's free choices back to God. He IS responsible. He made the rules, communicated his wants poorly, and gave us the power of reason, which, when used, exposes the bible for the crap it is.
(November 6, 2017 at 2:44 pm)alpha male Wrote: (November 6, 2017 at 2:32 pm)Astreja Wrote: The reason that the hell concept is a deal-breaker for me regarding the Christian god is that I can actually emphasize with people trapped in hell. Where is that empathy in the people defending the actions of that god?
Why do so many people defend the schoolyard bully and claim that the beat-up kid had it coming, rather than calling out the bully?
The difference with me is that I look at myself and think I deserve hell. So, for me, God isn't a bully. He's a righteous judge.
But we all aren't sick fucks like you.
"The last superstition of the human mind is the superstition that religion in itself is a good thing." - Samuel Porter Putnam
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:14 pm
Makes you wonder what they get up to on a saturday night, don't it, lol? To hear them talk, you'd think they had a cage full of children under their floorboards.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:21 pm
(This post was last modified: November 6, 2017 at 3:22 pm by Catholic_Lady.)
Just FYI, God doesn't "torture" people in Hell. Hell is a state of being where you make a conscious decision to turn away from God in the next life. And in doing so, you turn away from everything that is good and beautiful. When you don't have the physical world to distract you, you're left with nothing if not the love and goodness you rejected. The suffering comes from the emptiness of that, not from little horned men being ordered by God to burn you with torches.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:23 pm
(November 6, 2017 at 3:09 pm)Harry Nevis Wrote: But we all aren't sick fucks like you.
The strange thing is that you wouldn't even consider me a sick fuck for what I have in mind.
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:28 pm
(This post was last modified: November 6, 2017 at 3:28 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
What -we- think doesn't matter, though, does it? God should burn you for it, but instead we killed a jew and now it's all square.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:29 pm
(This post was last modified: November 6, 2017 at 3:30 pm by Catholic_Lady.)
(November 6, 2017 at 2:32 pm)Astreja Wrote: (November 6, 2017 at 12:21 pm)Khemikal Wrote: You can never turn your back on a person that demands a reason for considering a perpetual torturer insane. Who has to be argued -out- of thinking it's a legit idea.
The reason that the hell concept is a deal-breaker for me regarding the Christian god is that I can actually emphasize with people trapped in hell. Where is that empathy in the people defending the actions of that god?
Why do so many people defend the schoolyard bully and claim that the beat-up kid had it coming, rather than calling out the bully?
Even though i dont believe in the fire and brimstone version of hell you are presenting here, if that is how it was and someone like Hitler was there, id have a hard time feeling sorry for him. Or seeing him as a victim of bullying. Itd be pretty ironic to see him as a beat up kid or victim of bullying considering what he did in those concentration camps to millions of innocent people and families.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:32 pm
(This post was last modified: November 6, 2017 at 3:33 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Sure, for the first few hundred years, maybe....it would be easy to stuff down our better nature..for a time..in the case of Hitler. The thing about eternity, though, is that no matter how long somethings gone on...all the time in the world is still ahead of you.
Even the Fuhrer becomes a victim through torture. That's -why- we don't torture the people we kill.
#basics
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 3:58 pm
(November 6, 2017 at 2:44 pm)alpha male Wrote: The difference with me is that I look at myself and think I deserve hell. So, for me, God isn't a bully. He's a righteous judge.
You have my profound sympathies. I can only imagine what it's like to possess that degree of self-loathing and such a bizarre concept of justice.
(November 6, 2017 at 3:29 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Even though i dont believe in the fire and brimstone version of hell you are presenting here, if that is how it was and someone like Hitler was there, id have a hard time feeling sorry for him. Or seeing him as a victim of bullying. It'd be pretty ironic to see him as a beat up kid or victim of bullying considering what he did in those concentration camps to millions of innocent people and families.
Even so, what's the point in eternal suffering? Once the person being punished "gets it," fully comprehends the crime, why continue to punish?
I have a zero-tolerance stance on hell. I believe that no one deserves eternal punishment -- no exceptions.
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RE: Why did god allow people to be born after the fall ?
November 6, 2017 at 4:01 pm
They're not being punished. They suffer bc of the emptiness in themselves at their refusal to embrace God.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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