Hello and question about hell

[LastPoet]

The smell of sock puppet is strong on this one.

Indeed.

[Mister Agenda]

Hugs,

Nobody is saying this guy didn't experience something. But the experience itself proves nothing about the existence of an afterlife.

It's proof enough to him.

Truth is a personal fact that cannot always be demonstrated.

Plenty of people that experience NDE have no question that their experience was real.

How many people do you know that claim their dreams are real?

Having a real experience doesn't mean that what you're having an experience of is real, especially under conditions where your brain is highly stressed. Would you find the assertions of someone who saw a leprechaun on LSD as credible as someone who claimed to see one while there were, apparently at least, in their right mind? Or would you think the first leprechaun claim might be due to the LSD?

[brewer]

The smell of sock puppet is strong on this one.

Indeed.

[Huggy Bear]

It's proof enough to him.

Truth is a personal fact that cannot always be demonstrated.

Plenty of people that experience NDE have no question that their experience was real.

How many people do you know that claim their dreams are real?

That’s just it, though.

Many theists claim to have had “personal experiences” and want the rest of us to accept that as proof.

Personal experiences are only truly “proof” to those who “experienced” them.

Once while working A&E I had a patient brought in who was adamant he was being chased by a small man with big teeth and red skin.

That was proof to him.  The fact that he was higher than a kite at the time didn’t matter.  Should I have believed him just because he was so certain and wanted me to believe?

Every single example people have submitted had to do with drugs, this isn't even remotely the same thing.

There are cases of NDE where the brain wasn't functional; A non-functional brain does not hallucinate.

People usually don't maintain that a drug induced hallucination was a real experience, the exception being N,N-Dimethyltryptamine (a natural substance found in plants, animals, and the human body) in which people feel their experience was real, in fact DMT tends to have a similar life changing effect as NDE's

[Crossless2.0]

I don't get it when Christians tout NDEs as evidence of an afterlife. Don't you guys believe in the resurrection of the dead come Judgement Day? A disembodied consciousness that somehow survives brain death seems to be at odds with that. Is the glorified, resurrected body just an add-on? A nice but unnecessary touch?

[brewer]

Every single example people have submitted had to do with drugs, this isn't even remotely the same thing.

There are cases of NDE where the brain wasn't functional; A non-functional brain does not hallucinate.

People usually don't maintain that a drug induced hallucination was a real experience, the exception being N,N-Dimethyltryptamine (a natural substance found in plants, animals, and the human body) in which people feel their experience was real, in fact DMT tends to have a similar life changing effect as NDE's

Can you define "functional"? Is that registering in EEG? Do you have personal experience with this?

[Huggy Bear]

Every single example people have submitted had to do with drugs, this isn't even remotely the same thing.

There are cases of NDE where the brain wasn't functional; A non-functional brain does not hallucinate.

People usually don't maintain that a drug induced hallucination was a real experience, the exception being N,N-Dimethyltryptamine (a natural substance found in plants, animals, and the human body) in which people feel their experience was real, in fact DMT tends to have a similar life changing effect as NDE's

Can you define "functional"? Is that registering in EEG? Do you have personal experience with this?

How about I give you an example of 'non-functional'...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pam_Reynolds_case

Pam Reynolds Lowery (1956 – May 22, 2010), from Atlanta, Georgia, was an American singer-songwriter. In 1991, at the age of 35, she stated that she had a near-death experience (NDE) during a brain operation performed by Robert F. Spetzler at the Barrow Neurological Institute in Phoenix, Arizona. Her experience is one of the most widely documented in near-death studies because of the circumstances under which it happened. Reynolds was under close medical monitoring during the entire operation. During part of the operation she had no brain-wave activity and no blood flowing in her brain, which rendered her clinically dead. She claimed to have made several observations during the procedure which later medical personnel reported to be accurate.

[The Grand Nudger]

Can you define "functional"? Is that registering in EEG? Do you have personal experience with this?

How about I give you an example of 'non-functional'...

You have.  Many....many times. 

For example..presenting that link, and it's horribly disappointing terminus.

Woerlee, an anesthesiologist with many years of clinical experience, has considered this case in detail and remains unconvinced of the need for a paranormal explanation... [He] draws attention to the fact that Reynolds could only give a report of her experience some time after she recovered from the anesthetic as she was still intubated when she regained consciousness. This would provide some opportunity for her to associate and elaborate upon the sensations she had experienced during the operation with her existing knowledge and expectations. The fact that she described the small pneumatic saw used in the operation also does not impress Woerlee. As he points out, the saw sounds like and, to some extent, looks like the pneumatic drills used by dentists.[2]

[robvalue]

Welcome

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Remember that all we have to go on is the person describing their experience after the fact. They are probably the worst placed to accurately say when these "experiences" happened, and if they relate to anything real. The memory is notoriously unreliable, and I think it's the failure to acknowledge this that lets woo run rampant.

[Huggy Bear]

How about I give you an example of 'non-functional'...

You have.  Many....many times. 

For example..presenting that link, and it's horribly disappointing terminus.

Woerlee, an anesthesiologist with many years of clinical experience, has considered this case in detail and remains unconvinced of the need for a paranormal explanation... [He] draws attention to the fact that Reynolds could only give a report of her experience some time after she recovered from the anesthetic as she was still intubated when she regained consciousness. This would provide some opportunity for her to associate and elaborate upon the sensations she had experienced during the operation with her existing knowledge and expectations. The fact that she described the small pneumatic saw used in the operation also does not impress Woerlee. As he points out, the saw sounds like and, to some extent, looks like the pneumatic drills used by dentists.[2]

Yeah, because we all know anesthesiologists know more about the brain than brain surgeons...  

The article made it clear that there was ZERO brain activity, and ZERO blood flow to the brain, so how is the patient experiencing any 'sensations'?

I'll take the word of the surgical staff who performed the operation, you can keep your speculating anesthesiologist.

Lol