Posts: 13
Threads: 5
Joined: September 18, 2018
Reputation:
1
Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 8:15 pm
There have been several theories proposed that Jesus was not a real person. For example, he is a divine being that lived his life in the space between heaven and earth. I think Richard Carrier proposed this.
So one question I have, is if Jesus was completely made up, why is his name "Jesus"?
I would think based on prophecy, a 'fake' Jesus would have been named Immanuel. Not Jesus.
If you are going to make it up, you would make it up so that minor discrepancies such as this would be avoided.
Don't you think, then, that the gospels were at least based on a real person?
Posts: 5813
Threads: 86
Joined: November 19, 2017
Reputation:
59
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 8:36 pm
(This post was last modified: September 18, 2018 at 8:36 pm by vulcanlogician.)
I think it's likely that Jesus existed. But it's not like any of us will ever know one way or the other. There are pretty good arguments on both sides.
What really screws the people who are pushing that Jesus was a real person is the amount of myth and false documentation... ie obvious fabrications... that were made to try to prove his historicity. This casts a shadow of doubt upon everything.
Posts: 28448
Threads: 525
Joined: June 16, 2015
Reputation:
90
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 8:53 pm
Are you claiming that jesus was only a man, not a god/man mash up?
He may have been a man or many men but not a god.
Wiki can tell you how "jesus" came about as a name.
Also, Welcome Woof!
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental.
Posts: 69247
Threads: 3759
Joined: August 2, 2009
Reputation:
259
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 8:57 pm
Quote:I would think based on prophecy, a 'fake' Jesus would have been named Immanuel. Not Jesus.
The first thing you have to do is lose the notion that there is any coherence to this OT horseshit. "El" was the big kahuna in the Northern Kingdom so the "prophecy" of Immanu-el reflected the northern tradition. But the Assyrians took out the northern kingdom at the end of the 8th century and Judah, which had this yhwh character as their big god couldn't very well pay homage to El, could they?
There is an interesting book:
Holy Fable: The Old Testament Undistorted by Faith
Robert M. Price
Quote:In this first of a comprehensive two-volume study of the Old and New Testaments, Dr. Robert M. Price builds a spacious and sturdy ark to carry Bible readers over the floods of mystery that have long perplexed them. Why are there multiple creation stories? Who are the -sons of god- in Genesis? What's really going on with those Isaiah passages that preachers love to read at Christmas? Putting a lifetime of biblical scholarship hard at work on perhaps his most momentous project yet, Dr. Price explains the mysteries without scorning them. The beloved old Bible is revealed to be indeed a Fable, but still a Holy one in its sprawling and fascinating way.
Most xhristards heads would explode reading it but that's not my problem.
Posts: 18544
Threads: 145
Joined: March 18, 2015
Reputation:
100
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 8:58 pm
(September 18, 2018 at 8:15 pm)mrj Wrote: There have been several theories proposed that Jesus was not a real person. For example, he is a divine being that lived his life in the space between heaven and earth. I think Richard Carrier proposed this.
So one question I have, is if Jesus was completely made up, why is his name "Jesus"?
I would think based on prophecy, a 'fake' Jesus would have been named Immanuel. Not Jesus.
If you are going to make it up, you would make it up so that minor discrepancies such as this would be avoided.
Don't you think, then, that the gospels were at least based on a real person?
Batman is made up. Why is his name batman? Simple: The storytellers needed to give a name to their characters so they did.
/thread.
Disclaimer: I am only responsible for what I say, not what you choose to understand.
(November 14, 2018 at 8:57 pm)The Valkyrie Wrote: Have a good day at work. If we ever meet in a professional setting, let me answer your question now. Yes, I DO want fries with that.
Posts: 29107
Threads: 218
Joined: August 9, 2014
Reputation:
155
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 9:27 pm
(This post was last modified: September 18, 2018 at 9:32 pm by robvalue.)
The people who wrote about him didn't know whether it was a real person or not, based on the flimsy secondary information they had about him, if he existed at all. So we certainly can't know. At best we could say they intended to write about a real person. (They then either believed a load of magical events as part of that, or made it up themselves.)
Anyhow, his name wasn't Jesus either. That's a later change. The letter "j" wasn't used at the time. It was thought to have originally been written as something like Yeshua.
Posts: 9942
Threads: 21
Joined: September 8, 2015
Reputation:
79
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 9:30 pm
As we read them today, "Jesus" and apostles with names like "Mark", "Peter", are modern inventions. No one in the ME has a name like that, so when the buybull was written, they'd be called something else. This is only a small reason why I don't believe in any of that.
If you get to thinking you’re a person of some influence, try ordering somebody else’s dog around.
Posts: 67303
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
162
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 9:31 pm
(This post was last modified: September 18, 2018 at 9:32 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
They named the character Josh because Josh was a common name, due to being all heroic and whatnot. Josh Joe, son of god.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 29107
Threads: 218
Joined: August 9, 2014
Reputation:
155
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 9:36 pm
You may be interested in the evolution of the Jesus story, even within the bible itself.
Posts: 5664
Threads: 219
Joined: June 20, 2016
Reputation:
61
RE: Reason Jesus must have been a real person
September 18, 2018 at 9:56 pm
Carrier proposed Jesus as existing between heaven and earth? WTF?
God thinks it's fun to confuse primates. Larsen's God!
|
