Help me not fear heaven/hell

[adey67]

Hey, everyone. I thought I’d ask for some help here.

I was raised Christian but don’t believe in god anymore. I think it’s all nonsense. We’re on this pale blue dot alone. I believe in science and reason.

The problem is my atheism is only at 99%. There’s 1% of me that still thinks I could be wrong and that I’m going to hell for being a bad person. I’m also afraid of the idea of endless life, mostly because I struggle with anxiety and the idea of eternal anxiety in heaven is my idea of hell.

Can anyone help me unhinge the last 1% so that I’m not afraid of heaven and hell anymore? It would mean the world to me. I’d like to not have this hang over me for the rest of my life.

- Fleeing Jesus

My first comment is on the necessity of patience, typically fear of hell is one of the last things to go once you leave religion behind. It can take years for that nagging  fear to go away completely and sometimes it stays with people for their whole lives  all be it at a much reduced and manageable intensity.  

My second comment I hope will help you  to combat the anxiety you are feeling.
There is absolutely no evidence to suggest that humans have a soul/life force that is capable of surviving death.

The existence of an indestructible life force capable of housing our thoughts memories and personalities means that dementia head injuries brain tumours etc should have absolutely no effect on the above mentioned and yet we know they do.
Every thought personality trait etc is the result of the electro chemical reactions in our brain, that ends at death.

Of course the religious will counter this by saying that the soul is only activated at death or some such variation on a theme however that's just a desperate apologetic and must necessarily involve magical thinking.

It is a fact that philosophically no one can say with absolute certainty what happens after we die, where there are gaps in our knowledge there is always a greater than zero% chance of something being possible but just because something is philosophically possible doesn't make it plausible, to quote Mark Twain " I have been dead for billions of years before I was born and not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it"

[Fleeing Jesus]

I’ve been looking for help, this is true. Not a sock, though.

You might want to stop thinking that you're going to die tomorrow/soon.

Yeah, that’s its own problem. I struggle with that, too. : \

---

Hey, everyone. I thought I’d ask for some help here.

I was raised Christian but don’t believe in god anymore. I think it’s all nonsense. We’re on this pale blue dot alone. I believe in science and reason.

The problem is my atheism is only at 99%. There’s 1% of me that still thinks I could be wrong and that I’m going to hell for being a bad person. I’m also afraid of the idea of endless life, mostly because I struggle with anxiety and the idea of eternal anxiety in heaven is my idea of hell.

Can anyone help me unhinge the last 1% so that I’m not afraid of heaven and hell anymore? It would mean the world to me. I’d like to not have this hang over me for the rest of my life.

- Fleeing Jesus

My first comment is on the necessity of patience, typically fear of hell is one of the last things to go once you leave religion behind. It can take years for that nagging  fear to go away completely and sometimes it stays with people for their whole lives  all be it at a much reduced and manageable intensity.  

My second comment I hope will help you  to combat the anxiety you are feeling.
There is absolutely no evidence to suggest that humans have a soul/life force that is capable of surviving death.

The existence of an indestructible life force capable of housing our thoughts memories and personalities means that dementia head injuries brain tumours etc should have absolutely no effect on the above mentioned and yet we know they do.
Every thought personality trait etc is the result of the electro chemical reactions in our brain, that ends at death.

Of course the religious will counter this by saying that the soul is only activated at death or some such variation on a theme however that's just a desperate apologetic and must necessarily involve magical thinking.

It is a fact that philosophically no one can say with absolute certainty what happens after we die, where there are gaps in our knowledge there is always a greater than zero% chance of something being possible but just because something is philosophically possible doesn't make it plausible, to quote Mark Twain " I have been dead for billions of years before I was born and not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it"

This is a great response, thanks for this. I also like the one about fearing fire breathing dragons because my fear of them is at 0%. Remind me on my deathbed to chant “fire breathing dragons.”

---

Hey, everyone. I thought I’d ask for some help here.

I was raised Christian but don’t believe in god anymore. I think it’s all nonsense. We’re on this pale blue dot alone. I believe in science and reason.

The problem is my atheism is only at 99%. There’s 1% of me that still thinks I could be wrong and that I’m going to hell for being a bad person. I’m also afraid of the idea of endless life, mostly because I struggle with anxiety and the idea of eternal anxiety in heaven is my idea of hell.

Can anyone help me unhinge the last 1% so that I’m not afraid of heaven and hell anymore? It would mean the world to me. I’d like to not have this hang over me for the rest of my life.

- Fleeing Jesus

So, is the idea of life simply ending when you die less scary than the idea of an afterlife? This would be the opposite of how many people feel, which is interesting. I don't really know if anyone can help you stop fearing hell or an afterlife; I think you just sort of have to think this through. You don't remember anything before you were born, right? And why would you? You did not have a conscious brain to experience anything... so... same thing for when you die. When your brain dies, you get turned off. And there's nothing. 

And while we don't "know" this, we really have no reason to think otherwise. So far as we understand it, consciousness is the result of electrical activity in the brain. Once that activity goes dead, so does our conscious mind. Death, so far as we know, is just like before you were born... there is simply nothing. The computer gets shut down. You get powered off and you're gone forever. A little unsettling, actually. But it's all the more reason to enjoy things while you're here!

Honestly, an afterlife scares me more than oblivion. I’ve suffered from a psychiatric drug-induced condition in the past called akathisia where you can’t stop moving your body (even when exhausted). It’s so terrible that people who suffer from it chronically are six times more likely to kill themselves than people with depression. The thought that there’s no end to that kind of suffering is far scarier than the idea of oblivion at death. I’ve been in tears before begging my parents to tell me that there’s no god so that when I die I will at least be at peace. It’s literally hell on earth and the thought that there’s no end to it is the single worst thing I can imagine.

[Rahn127]

If you truly had a soul that is independent from your body, meaning it has it's own thoughts, it's own awareness (seeing, hearing, feeling, etc), then when your brain is unconscious, you should be able to see, think and feel stuff, but that doesn't happen.

When your brain is unconscious, there are no thoughts, no feelings, no sight, etc.

When you are unconscious, you cannot determine if you are unconscious or if you are dead.

[Catharsis]

If you truly had a soul that is independent from your body, meaning it has it's own thoughts, it's own awareness (seeing, hearing, feeling, etc), then when your brain is unconscious, you should be able to see, think and feel stuff, but that doesn't happen.

When your brain is unconscious, there are no thoughts, no feelings, no sight, etc.

When you are unconscious, you cannot determine if you are unconscious or if you are dead.

What about near death experiences?

Hallucinations of an unconscious brain lacking oxygen?

[Brian37]

If you truly had a soul that is independent from your body, meaning it has it's own thoughts, it's own awareness (seeing, hearing, feeling, etc), then when your brain is unconscious, you should be able to see, think and feel stuff, but that doesn't happen.

When your brain is unconscious, there are no thoughts, no feelings, no sight, etc.

When you are unconscious, you cannot determine if you are unconscious or if you are dead.

What about near death experiences?

Hallucinations of an unconscious brain lacking oxygen?

There is a reason the superstitious call this crap "near death". It is away of mentally clinging to superstition without admitting it is crap.

There is a huge difference between coming close, and going beyond the window of repair. 

Clinical death can be simply a doctor or nurse not finding vitals. That does happen only to have the patent come out of it. But in that case that is not permanent death, just merely having enough juice that flies under the radar.

Permanent death is beyond any repair, and nobody survives that. If one put a grenade in their mouth and pulled the pin, (NOT RECOMMENDING, DO NOT TRY THAT AT ANY TIME), your head would get blown off, and you would not come back from that.

If someone comes out of a medical emergency it only means there was just enough juice to allow for a recovery. That state isn't always detected by medical staff. 

Point is, nobody survives permanent death. I watched my late mother take her last breath, and she did not jump up out of her bed 5 minutes later much less an hour or a day later. 

I agree, though, humans do not understand medically speaking, how when we are not talking about something like a decapitation, how someone can "seemingly" survive death, when the reality is, if they come out of it, they were never dead at all.

The superstitious could quite easily prove surviving death is possible if they could prove it was possible to survive a decapitation.  They wont conduct such an experiment, nor would I recommend it.

[EgoDeath]

Honestly, an afterlife scares me more than oblivion. I’ve suffered from a psychiatric drug-induced condition in the past called akathisia where you can’t stop moving your body (even when exhausted). It’s so terrible that people who suffer from it chronically are six times more likely to kill themselves than people with depression. The thought that there’s no end to that kind of suffering is far scarier than the idea of oblivion at death. I’ve been in tears before begging my parents to tell me that there’s no god so that when I die I will at least be at peace. It’s literally hell on earth and the thought that there’s no end to it is the single worst thing I can imagine.

In all seriousness, have you thought about seeking professional help? Or have you already done so? You seem to have an unhealthy obsession with this. It seems like it'd be super uncomfortable, to say the least.

[Abaddon_ire]

If you truly had a soul that is independent from your body, meaning it has it's own thoughts, it's own awareness (seeing, hearing, feeling, etc), then when your brain is unconscious, you should be able to see, think and feel stuff, but that doesn't happen.

When your brain is unconscious, there are no thoughts, no feelings, no sight, etc.

When you are unconscious, you cannot determine if you are unconscious or if you are dead.

What about near death experiences?

Hallucinations of an unconscious brain lacking oxygen?

I've had one of those.

[Fleeing Jesus]

[quote="EgoDeath" pid='1892950' dateline='1553026899']
[quote='Fleeing Jesus' pid='1892701' dateline='1552951589']


[quote]

In all seriousness, have you thought about seeking professional help? Or have you already done so? You seem to have an unhealthy obsession with this. It seems like it'd be super uncomfortable, to say the least.
[/quote]

I’m in the process of getting help for it. It does scare me quite a bit. My evenings alone are awful. I thought people here could help me and they have, for the most part. The idea that there’s no evidence for a indestructible life force and that nothing survives death have helped me a lot. And the notion that I’m not afraid of fire breathing dragons. I’m sure I’ll feel better about this in a month or so once my drug withdrawal levels out.

[fredd bear]

Honestly, an afterlife scares me more than oblivion. I’ve suffered from a psychiatric drug-induced condition in the past called akathisia where you can’t stop moving your body (even when exhausted). It’s so terrible that people who suffer from it chronically are six times more likely to kill themselves than people with depression. The thought that there’s no end to that kind of suffering is far scarier than the idea of oblivion at death. I’ve been in tears before begging my parents to tell me that there’s no god so that when I die I will at least be at peace. It’s literally hell on earth and the thought that there’s no end to it is the single worst thing I can imagine.

In all seriousness, have you thought about seeking professional help? Or have you already done so? You seem to have an unhealthy obsession with this. It seems like it'd be super uncomfortable, to say the least.

 
Not a good idea to let others decide on what you will or will not believe. You have asked THE question. It's up to you to decide. Nobody can decide for you, because nobody actually knows for a fact.

There are great many deluded people unable to distinguish between knowledge and belief. No matter how loudly a believer insists that he KNOWS, the truth remains that he does not know. He merely believes. Unfortunately the only way of finding out is to die.

I'm glad you are seeking professional help. I urge you to seek help from a counsellor who has no religious agenda.

The symptoms you have described sound like "Thanatophobia", or 'death anxiety"unusual but by no means unique. A professional should be able to help you. Good luck.

[The Grand Nudger]

In the meantime, why not use that fear, it's a powerful motivator.  If you're worried about being a bad person (and whatever consequence may arise)...then rectify that situation.  

Find those things about yourself that give you that impression and work to change them.  Not believing in gods will never amount to not believing in the idea of being a good or bad person.  Atheism can't help you there.