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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 7:56 am
(This post was last modified: April 19, 2020 at 7:56 am by The Grand Nudger.)
The presence of rhyming patterns...at all.. strongly suggests otherwise, lol.
-and why not. Rock out with your cock out if you wrote a catchy jingle.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 8:02 am
My last post in this thread , lol
Quote:So, [O Muhammad], We have only made Qur'an easy in the Arabic language that you may give good tidings thereby to the righteous and warn thereby a hostile people.
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 8:43 am
(This post was last modified: April 19, 2020 at 8:45 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Well, that's disappointing, we only got to talk about the first of an endless number of limericks which all satisfy the challenge made in magic book of producing a work of greater literary skill and beauty. We never even made it to the more complicated stuff like dr. seuss. Rhymes and illustrations!
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 10:50 am
(April 19, 2020 at 2:11 am)WinterHold Wrote: (March 1, 2020 at 7:14 pm)chimp3 Wrote: OK! I own a copy by Abdullah Yusef Ali with English translation. If I accept that the original is expressed accurately in all it's copies, why should I accept the original is true?
As a speaker of Arabic -both slang and formal, being a native Arab-, the translations are accurate. I understand English quite well and I didn't find notable "reforging" if any; the Arabic text is always the same -to the letter- but translations differ in small words but mainly the meaning is intact just since the source is intact.
You can see an example of that in this verse for example:
https://quran.com/2/256?translations=
to translate it myself:
لا
No
اكراه
Compulsion
في
In
الدين
Religion -an implicit reference to Islam-
قد
Had
تبين
became obvious
الرشد
The guidance
من
From
الغي
The wrong
ف
So
من
Whoever
يكفر
Disbelieves
ب
In
الطاغوت
The false God
و
and
يؤمن
Believes
ب
In
الله
Allah
فقد
Has
استمسك
Grasped
ب
In
العروة
The grip
الوثقى
The trustworthy
لا
No
انفصام
No break
لها
In it
و
and
الله
Allah
سميع
Hearing
عليم
Knowing
--------------------------
Most translations translate with minor differences like in the word "العروة"; while I chose "the grip" as its translation maybe other translators would choose the word "the handle".
Of course you can see that this no reason to start a sectarian civil war, but anyways the Muslims who say the Quran is not obvious to justify engaging in sectarian war are just extremists wanting interest for spilling blood.
Anyways, this is my opinion about the translation; reading for many translators would shed the light on the verse you would like to understand and read.
I am not seeking to understand any verse. My question is why I should believe any of it is true?
God thinks it's fun to confuse primates. Larsen's God!
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 12:17 pm
(April 19, 2020 at 10:50 am)chimp3 Wrote: I am not seeking to understand any verse. My question is why I should believe any of it is true?
For me personally, I can't imagine our universe without a creator. Outer space is gigantic so as life, both are orchestrated in a way that points to a creator. My field of work is computer programming; so I know exactly how the role of a creator is essential to act as a springing point for any logic in the void.
There are patterns in this life, but I find the Quran having the best explanation for the patterns of this universe. I would say: observe the life around you and see the explanation the Quran gives then choose.
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 12:21 pm
The failures of your own imagination impose no limits on the universe.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 12:31 pm
(April 19, 2020 at 12:17 pm)WinterHold Wrote: (April 19, 2020 at 10:50 am)chimp3 Wrote: I am not seeking to understand any verse. My question is why I should believe any of it is true?
For me personally, I can't imagine our universe without a creator. Outer space is gigantic so as life, both are orchestrated in a way that points to a creator. My field of work is computer programming; so I know exactly how the role of a creator is essential to act as a springing point for any logic in the void.
There are patterns in this life, but I find the Quran having the best explanation for the patterns of this universe. I would say: observe the life around you and see the explanation the Quran gives then choose.
It doesn't occur to you that there is a disparity of scale between the Universe and the region occupied by life?
Quote:I don't understand why you'd come to a discussion forum, and then proceed to reap from visibility any voice that disagrees with you. If you're going to do that, why not just sit in front of a mirror and pat yourself on the back continuously?
- Esquilax
Evolution - Adapt or be eaten.
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 12:45 pm
(April 19, 2020 at 12:17 pm)WinterHold Wrote: (April 19, 2020 at 10:50 am)chimp3 Wrote: I am not seeking to understand any verse. My question is why I should believe any of it is true?
For me personally, I can't imagine our universe without a creator. Outer space is gigantic so as life, both are orchestrated in a way that points to a creator. My field of work is computer programming; so I know exactly how the role of a creator is essential to act as a springing point for any logic in the void.
There are patterns in this life, but I find the Quran having the best explanation for the patterns of this universe. I would say: observe the life around you and see the explanation the Quran gives then choose.
I am not convinced.
God thinks it's fun to confuse primates. Larsen's God!
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 1:00 pm
(April 19, 2020 at 7:38 am)Ashwin39 Wrote: 114 chapters , 6,236 verses
Mahabharata; 200,000 verses...
As for rhyming..
Quote:I don't understand why you'd come to a discussion forum, and then proceed to reap from visibility any voice that disagrees with you. If you're going to do that, why not just sit in front of a mirror and pat yourself on the back continuously?
- Esquilax
Evolution - Adapt or be eaten.
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RE: Muslims: If the Koran is Unaltered...
April 19, 2020 at 1:06 pm
(April 19, 2020 at 12:45 pm)chimp3 Wrote: I am not convinced.
Really? You are not convinced by this?
![[Image: Buraq.jpg]](https://i.postimg.cc/qMTgqWxZ/Buraq.jpg)
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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