Kanye West on Alex Jones

[Irreligious Atheist]

My comment is not sussy, because I've never insulted Jews as a people. I literally posted that I admire their family values, and they put us lame, deadbeat, self-hating whites to shame, as do Asian Americans. I don't think whites are any super master race. That's beyond dumb. I don't even believe in race and understand that it's just a social construct, so again, you can suspect whatever you want.

Yes, your comment is sussy. No matter how much you dance around it.

Have you stopped watching Vaush yet, who according to Nudge, is pushing Reigh Wing talking points? Half of the big lefty streamers agreeing with me about the anti-white rhetoric being cringe and soy is probably just something that Nudge thinks proves his point. They're huwhite streamers afterall, so Nudge will just see that as proving his point that white people can't acknowledge their own bullshit. And why are 90 % of the big lefty political streamers huwhite folks? Again, the argument will be that they get all of the viewers because of white supremacy. Vaush and Destiny viewers like myself are not willing to give political streamers of colour a watch, so white supremacy lives on, etc, etc.

Just because a leftist streamer says it doesn't mean I have to agree with it. Also if they agree with you that wouldn't make them white supremacists it would simply make them wrong on this subject . You, by contrast, are a different story I don't think you are wrong I think you're insidious. So appealing to authority or popularity isn't going to help you here.


Another very silly response from you.

I'm not saying because half of lefty political streamers hold a similar position to mine, that therefore my position is correct or not immoral. That would be an argument from popularity, as you mention. I'm only mentioning that reality about half of lefty big time political streamers to make the point that not only the reich wing are talking about anti-white stuff being cringe. The right is saying that, but so are half of the big time lefties too. Again, that doesn't prove that I'm not a bigot. To Nudge, it will just prove that those 50 percent of lefty political streamers are also bigots like me and they don't get it just like me, and most of the popular lefty streamers are white, which will just prove to Nudge that lefty whites choose to spend their time listening to other white people like them, because they're inherently part of the problem, and the cycle continues, etc. White fragility, etc.

[Thumpalumpacus]

So you've never been to an AA meeting but you know why every single member ever has gone there?

You're so full of shit your eyes are brown.


Determinism is an undemonstrated and axiomatic belief. I've done enough research to know that you're grandly overstating your case ... as per norm.

Yes, people don't go to AA if they don't have the will to go there. The will has to be there, and we don't choose whether we have that will or not. Again, you have provided me with no evidence. Remember, you were the one who posted the Hitchens quote, and now you dishonour Hitchens memory by refusing to provide evidence to back up your claims. I see you just posted that Hitchens quote to try to get a zinger on me, when you don't live by the Hitchens quote yourself. I knew it. I called it.

Whether the universe runs by hard determinism or not, there is still no free will either way. No ghost in the machine. We are not separate from the universe. We are merely the universe made conscious. Being part of the universe, we follow the laws of cause and effect just like anything else. Provide evidence otherwise, or you are no better than Joseph Smith claiming you dug up some gold tablets and talked to an angel, or a flat earther who claims the earth is flat because it looks that way when they look out of their window.

Your belief in determinism is axiomatic, which means that it is beyond the reach of evidence. My belief in free will is axiomatic, because I have no evidence for it other than my subjective experience, and those subjective experiences reported to me by others.

Fortunately for me, I'm not trying to change your mind about this, just disagreeing with your unevidenced axiom.

As for "dishonoring" his memory, do you drama-queen much? Or should I ask do you context much?

At any rate, arguing this with you is a waste of time for reasons stated above. If you'd like to argue more, return to the Ukraine thread and resume trying to defend your might-makes-right horseshit. At least that's more interesting in a real-world sense. From here it seems like you prefer arguments without evidence, though.

[Thumpalumpacus]

From Kanye having a slave name to why people attend AA meetings.

Makes perfect sense, as per usual.

Apparently Kanye's stupidity is not his own fault. He's a victim of his own atoms deciding for him, and powerless to change anything about himself, including his decisions.

Hope that ties it together a little?

[Thumpalumpacus]

I will admit the AA meeting were a bit of a diversion....have you met IA?

To be fair, I was the one who brought them up in arguing against the idea that no one really makes a decision.

[The Architect Of Fate]

I'm not saying because half of lefty political streamers hold a similar position to mine, that therefore my position is correct or not immoral. That would be an argument from popularity, as you mention. I'm only mentioning that reality about half of lefty big time political streamers to make the point that not only the reich wing are talking about anti-white stuff being cringe. The right is saying that, but so are half of the big time lefties too. Again, that doesn't prove that I'm not a bigot. To Nudge, it will just prove that those 50 percent of lefty political streamers are also bigots like me and they don't get it just like me, and most of the popular lefty streamers are white, which will just prove to Nudge that lefty whites choose to spend their time listening to other white people like them, because they're inherently part of the problem, and the cycle continues, etc. White fragility, etc.

Nope none of this follows 

A number of large Youtube streamers could repeat Reich Wing talking points in ignorance and without malice and Nudge could accept that without contradiction. So this point is moot.  So if this is going to argument against Nudge I suggest you think harder.

[Irreligious Atheist]

Yes, people don't go to AA if they don't have the will to go there. The will has to be there, and we don't choose whether we have that will or not. Again, you have provided me with no evidence. Remember, you were the one who posted the Hitchens quote, and now you dishonour Hitchens memory by refusing to provide evidence to back up your claims. I see you just posted that Hitchens quote to try to get a zinger on me, when you don't live by the Hitchens quote yourself. I knew it. I called it.

Whether the universe runs by hard determinism or not, there is still no free will either way. No ghost in the machine. We are not separate from the universe. We are merely the universe made conscious. Being part of the universe, we follow the laws of cause and effect just like anything else. Provide evidence otherwise, or you are no better than Joseph Smith claiming you dug up some gold tablets and talked to an angel, or a flat earther who claims the earth is flat because it looks that way when they look out of their window.

Your belief in determinism is axiomatic, which means that it is beyond the reach of evidence. My belief in free will is axiomatic, because I have no evidence for it other than my subjective experience, and those subjective experiences reported to me by others.

Fortunately for me, I'm not trying to change your mind about this, just disagreeing with your unevidenced axiom.

As for "dishonoring" his memory, do you drama-queen much? Or should I ask do you context much?

At any rate, arguing this with you is a waste of time for reasons stated above. If you'd like to argue more, return to the Ukraine thread and resume trying to defend your might-makes-right horseshit. At least that's more interesting in a real-world sense. From here it seems like you prefer arguments without evidence, though.

Being able to consciously make decisions would mean that we would have immunity to cause and effect. Are you claiming we have immunity to cause and effect, and that we don't have to follow the same rules that the rest of the universe has to follow? Again, you are sounding like a theist here. Free will or no free will is not a 50-50 proposition where we can parrot a theistic argument by saying, "Welp, I can't prove God, but you can't disprove him either" Free will existing is your claim, and until you can provide a shred of evidence for your position, then your position will remain a fantastical and religious position. Things not existing is the default. That goes for ghosts, gods, fairies, and free will. Especially free will. Ghosts and fairies actually have a far higher chance of existing in our known universe, because they are not as big of squared circles as the idea of conscious decision making. And since you say you've spent plenty of time looking into this topic, I'm sure you know about the neuroscience experiments that suggest many decisions are made unconsciously, and several seconds in advance before we are aware of them consciously.

Hitchens would not be amused with your "I'm wasting my time" retort in response to me calling you out for having zippo in terms of evidence after you made such a fuss about me not having 100 percent proof a few days back. Hitch still rolling over in his grave. Your "evidence" is that you saw a puddle of water from a distance on the road, and you were sure it wasn't just a mirage.

[The Architect Of Fate]

Using the legacy of slavery to get attention for himself? Hmm. Isn't that what people on the right have to say about Al Sharpton, Ben Crump, and so on?

Whataboutism. The fact other people may or not do this as well does not absolve Kanye from doing so.

That they're using slavery? 

Again whataboutism 

How about we stop using right-wing arguments? 

It's not a right-wing argument it's a theory that perfectly matches  Kanye's ego driven mindset and lack of scruples.

Ye, as a black man and a descendant of slaves, as far as I know, has a right to not be over slavery, whether he's an egomaniac or not, and surely he is an egomaniac.

I never said he should over slavery so that's a strawman. I did say using the legacy of slavery for a cheap publicity stunt to yourself some headlines is gross. Those are not the same thing.

So is Al Sharpton though, but that doesn't mean Al doesn't, therefore, get to mention slavery.

I never said you couldn't mention slavery. So yet another strawman. Kanye can talk about slavery all he wants. 

That's not quite how things work.

Considering all the strawmen you threw out thus far you don't seem to understand how anything works .

 And you know how I can be pretty sure that Ye really does identify with that name and he is serious about it? Ye's been his nickname for over a decade now.

Irrelevant. He could be using that nickname name for 100 years. The fact he only started using it as his real name recently and kept his birth name at all is suspect.

 He didn't just get a focus group together to come up with a new name out of the blue to pull off a publicity stunt.

Whether it was a focus group or he came up with it by himself the fact he only started using it as his true name says publicity stunt. You have refuted nothing.

He's been called Ye pretty much forever now.

Again the fact he has been using his birth name and only switched to another as his primary name says publicity stunt. You have refuted nothing.

And again, it doesn't bother me if anyone wants to call him Kanye.

Says the person who has literally a paragraph about this.

Don't let me stop you.

You couldn't even if you wanted to.

 I just like to point it out when I see people having a lack of consistent values. 

My values are totally consistent and to date, you have never shown otherwise except through bare assertion.

Caitlyn Jenner doesn't believe in gay marriage. Caitlyn Jenner was involved in a car crash that led to a person's death, and that was all brushed under the rug. I'll give Ye the same basic decency I give Caitlyn.

Caitlyn Jenner is legitimately a woman and I will address her as such despite her bad politics. Kanye is a co-artist who just looking for attention. There is nothing inconsistent with treating them accordingly.

 Our identities are what we say they are. 

Nope in Kanye case, I refuse to assume that position, and my reasons are totally consistent and reasonable. I will not feed an egomaniac's sense of self-importance. 

Now, if we're talking about a really sussy case like that person who shot up club Q who claimed to be non-binary, that is obviously fair game I'd say to question their non-binaryness, because the incentive to lie in that case to avoid hate crime charges or whatever is glaringly clear.

Yes that person is clearly faking it (just like Kanye)

 In Ye's case, though, not so much, since he's been called Ye, for, you know, over a decade now.

I repeated it one final time it does matter how long he used it as a nickname. He became famous as Kanye West and didn't seem to have an issue with it till recently and didn't make his nickname his true name till recently to me that screams " I did this for attention"


So congrats you wrote this long rambly paragraph to say nothing at all.

[The Architect Of Fate]

There is nothing in physics that refutes free will and nothing in cause and effect that rules out free choices as has been argued by several physicists(John Conway, Simon Kochen, George Ellis,) and the conclusion of Neuroscience experiments on intent have had several interpretations some of which are totally compatible with free will. As Chomsky pointed out.

In the last couple of years ago, there were experiments showing that, when people make decisions, for example when I decide to pick up this cup, milliseconds before I make the decision, there is activity in the brain in the areas where you are going to act, i.e., milliseconds before I make the decision, the motor areas of the brain are already organized to pick the cup up. That evidence was used widely to conclude that this shows that we don’t have free will. But this doesn’t show anything of this sort. This just shows that decisions are unconscious. We all know that, if we think for a minute: of course decisions are unconscious. Some of them reach the level of consciousness, some of them we can’t even act on, but there is a lot there going on unconsciously, probably everything of interest, and we don’t know how to deal with it.

Neuroscience experiments will not solve the issue of free will and physics won't either. We are not rocks we are thinking entities.

[The Architect Of Fate]

Also, Hitchens believed in free will and believed theistic theories of free will were nonsense.

[Thumpalumpacus]

blahblahblahIknowhowadeadmanwouldfeelblahblahblah

Are you hard of English, man?

At any rate, arguing this with you is a waste of time for reasons stated above.

I don't waste my time bandying words with fools, and will not make any further exception for you.