Politically Progressive Section

[reverendjeremiah]

This thread subscription has everything to do with World Wide Political Progressive thought, platform discussions, current events with progressive opinions, and other things World Wide Progressive!

Frequently Asked Questions?
#1 - Are Progressives Communists?
Progressives are NOT Communists! We also get upset at the mention of assuming we are Communists! Progressives oppose the aggresive authoritarianism that Communism imposes socially and economically upon its citizens. Progressives tend to prefer a mixed economy, Economic justice through tax laws, a welfare system. Progressives are opposed to forced redistribution of wealth.

#2 - Are Progressives Socialists?
Progressives are NOT Socialists! We also get upset at the mention of assuming we are Socialists! We do, however, see some beneficial policies in certain parts of Socialism. Progressives tend to frown upon Ideological or "pure" Socialism for its tendency to become authoritarian socially and economically. Progressive seek a "mixed" economy of the best parts of Capitalism and Socialism.

#3 - Are Progressives Nazi/Fascist?
Progressives are NOT Nazi or Fascist! We get EXTREMELY upset at the mention of assuming we are Fascists! Progressivism was created to specifically oppose Fascism! Fascism is also related to "Corporatism" and "Meritocracy". Economic justice and social justice go hand in hand. Progressives are opposed to forced redistribution of wealth wether from the rich to the poor, or from the poor to the rich, and that the tax system should reflect this concept sternly. Progressives consider the statemanship of the day to oppose, and disrupt, the union between between corupt politicians and corupt corporations. War profiteering should be dealt with harshly.

#3 - Are Progressives Anarchists?
Progressives are NOT Anarchists! We will laugh at you at the mention of assuming we are Anarchists! We are anti-authoritarian, not anti-government. We feel that social laws should be kept to a bare minimum, and those laws should only protect the life, liberty, and property of society as individuals and as a whole regardless of wether they share the majority social views and beliefs or not. We feel that economic laws should also be kept to a moderate level to protect the welfare of each citizen and the reasonable ecology of their environment.

#4 - Are Progressives Libertarians?
Progressives are NOT Libertarians! Progressives will become slightly annoyed at the mention of assuming we are Libertarians. Progressives and Libertarians share a common ideological heritage called "The Age of Enlightenment" and especially through the writtings of John Locke. Libertarians and Progressives share equal views regarding social freedoms, individual freedoms, and social liberal theory. Progressives split from Libertarians in what is known as the "Classical vs. Modern" liberal split in the mid to late 19th century due to disagreements on economic views. Classic Liberals took on the name "Libertarians" and prefered to keep the liberal economics, while Modern Liberals eventually took on the name "Progressive" and encorporated a mixed economic outlook.

#5 - Are Progressives Conservatives?
Progressives are NOT Conservatives! Progressives will become EXTREMELY upset at the mention of assuming we are Conservatives! Conservatives socially stand for the exact opposite of what Progressives stand for. Neo-Conservatives (Neo-Cons for short) stand diametrically opposed to Progressives socially and economically. Neo-Cons want an established religion and they generally oppose: sexual freedom, gay marriage, science that contradicts theology, public schools, minority rights, minority beliefs, welfare, Social Security, the non-religious, labor unions, living wage, mixed economies, etc.

#6 - Are Progressive Liberals?
Progressives ARE Modern Liberals and Social Liberals! Some on the authoritarian right wing have claimed that Liberals hide behind the name "Progressive" so that they do not have to reveal that they are liberal because they think the word "liberal" is a negative and hated word. In reality the word "Progressive" has been historically used as the name of choice by Social Liberals since the later half of the 19th century in Western Civilization. Some right wingers have tried to take the name "Progressive" hoping to ride its popularity. Progressives are historically moderate left wing.

What is Progressivism?

Progressivism is a political attitude favoring or advocating changes or reform through governmental action. Progressivism is often viewed in opposition to conservative or reactionary ideologies. The Progressive Movement began in cities with settlement workers and reformers who were interested in helping those facing harsh conditions at home and at work. The reformers spoke out about the need for laws regulating tenement housing and child labor. They also called for better working conditions for women.

In the United States, the term progressivism emerged in the late 19th century into the 20th century in reference to a more general response to the vast changes brought by industrialization: an alternative to both the traditional conservative response to social and economic issues and to the various more radical streams of socialism and anarchism which opposed them. Political parties, such as the Progressive Party, organized at the start of the 20th century, and progressivism made great strides under American presidents Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, Franklin Delano Roosevelt, and Lyndon Baines Johnson.

What is Modern Liberalism?

Modern American liberalism is a form of social liberalism developed from progressive ideals such as Theodore Roosevelt's New Nationalism, Woodrow Wilson's New Freedom, Franklin D. Roosevelt's New Deal, John F. Kennedy's New Frontier, and Lyndon Johnson's Great Society. It combines social liberalism and social progressivism with support for a welfare state and a mixed economy. American liberal causes include voting rights for African Americans, abortion rights for women, gay rights and government entitlements such as education and health care.

Feel free to visit these American Progressive website URL's
http://www.progressive.org/
http://www.theyoungturks.com/
http://front.moveon.org/

[HeyItsZeus]

So are we going to have rivaling threads?

[reverendjeremiah]

Nope..this is a world wide progressive section that all left leaners can subscribe to. I will be dealing with world wide progressivism, as well as American.

[Violet]

Progressives are NOT Communists! We also get upset at the mention of assuming we are Communists!

What if I am a pinko commie bastard?

Progressives are NOT Socialists! We also get upset at the mention of assuming we are Socialists!

I absolutely am a socialist.

Progressives are NOT Nazi or Fascist! Progressivism was created to specifically oppose Fascism!

Void seems to think I'm a fascist.

Progressivism is a political attitude favoring or advocating changes or reform through governmental action. Progressivism is often viewed in opposition to conservative or reactionary ideologies. The Progressive Movement began in cities with settlement workers and reformers who were interested in helping those facing harsh conditions at home and at work. The reformers spoke out about the need for laws regulating tenement housing and child labor. They also called for better working conditions for women.

First line works well enough through all three of the things you say it is not. Socialism is not necessarily conservative, and I also don't think communism has shown to be considerably conservative (i mean... it was introduced through a few revolts and all...). Fascists are typically conservative, doesn't mean they have to be.

So... progressives are misguided socialists?

[reverendjeremiah]

Is this the beginning of the end for right wing talk radio in America?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCaP910LmHA&

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So... progressives are misguided socialists?

No, Progressives are Captialists who oppose aggresive corporatism, or corporatism in general, specifically the union between the corrupt politician and the corrupt corporation. Progressives are NOT socialists, they are what I like to call "soft capitalists", meaning that they frown upon the "cut throat capitalism" where people make profit from ruining the lives of others. I would go so far as to say most Progressives do not consider clean water, basic food, basic education, and basic shelter to be Capitalised. In other words, Progressives stand strong for a basic "survival net" for society to keep it from regressing to past social systems such as Feudalism, Slavery, and Serfism. Progressives want a profit motive to keep good ideas flowing, but do not consider it the end all be all of society. Progressives will say "workers of the world, unite!" but do so under the banner of Capitalism, not Communism. Progressive are socially anti-authoritarian, and economically moderate left.

[theVOID]

Bahahahaha that's hilarious, what a retard.

[reverendjeremiah]

Bahahahaha that's hilarious, what a retard.

In a somewhat defense for Mike Savage, he screens his callers, and the list specified what she was calling about...so he wasnt randomly going ape shit on her.

With that said, if he didnt want to deal with her, why didnt he just ignore the call "and we're moving on". I have lots of experience in talk radio, acting, producing, and editing wise. This man OBVIOUSLY wanted to do what he did. This wasnt a spur of the moment thing. He was planning on blowing up at somebody before he even started the show. He knows his ratings are dropping, so he wants to get some free publicity by acting the ass.

This strategy doesnt always work out to your advantage.

[reverendjeremiah]

What if I am a pinko commie bastard?

I always imagined "pinko" to be a "watered down red", like a half assed Communist. Its right wing authoritarian types who tend to use the word "pinko". I think they use it to say that Commie bastards are feminised, or gay, or weak or something. LOL, who knows? I have been called a "pinko commie" as well. Communists are usually authoritarians, and Progressives dont like extremism or authoritarianism. Usually when I tell them that, they are scratching their heads. Apparently Glenn Beck forgot to mention that. Glenn Beck also forgot to mention that "Conservative Libertarian" is LESS like Classic Libertarianism and more like Fascism (sans the overt claims of racism and eugeneics). Funny how he screams "Nazi" at everything that isnt Nazi..dont you think?

I absolutely am a socialist.

I tend to get along more with Socialists than Communists. It doesnt mean I agree with them. I just see a bit more common ground with them than I do Communists. Some say Socialism is the same as Communism, but I disagree.Even Marx said that Socialism and Communism are different. Then again, Marx is a bit over rated if you ask me. It didnt take long for people (er...dictators more like it) to start changing his ideas and then adding their names to it.

Void seems to think I'm a fascist.

Void is smart. Very smart. I've got a lot of respect for him and you Sae. I will put my foot down and say that Fascism isnt any where near Socialism. Fascism glorified and legitimized the war pigs and the war profiteers and claimed it under "the workers" for "socialism". Sort of like how some right wing groups ride the popularity of the name "Progressive" to get into power in some countries. The only thing "progressive" about them is their party name.

First line works well enough through all three of the things you say it is not. Socialism is not necessarily conservative, and I also don't think communism has shown to be considerably conservative (i mean... it was introduced through a few revolts and all...). Fascists are typically conservative, doesn't mean they have to be.

First line is merely a statement of fact for Progressives. I have added a bit more information to the intro page since you have posted. What you read was my basic to get the page started. I plan on upgrading the introduction page every now and then.

[Violet]

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I always imagined "pinko" to be a "watered down red", like a half assed Communist. Its right wing authoritarian types who tend to use the word "pinko". I think they use it to say that Commie bastards are feminised, or gay, or weak or something. LOL, who knows? I have been called a "pinko commie" as well. Communists are usually authoritarians, and Progressives dont like extremism or authoritarianism. Usually when I tell them that, they are scratching their heads. Apparently Glenn Beck forgot to mention that. Glenn Beck also forgot to mention that "Conservative Libertarian" is LESS like Classic Libertarianism and more like Fascism (sans the overt claims of racism and eugeneics). Funny how he screams "Nazi" at everything that isnt Nazi..dont you think?

Well, I'm much more likely red than pink in that case... depends on how communism is defined I guess.

My economic beliefs are not quite identical (though government = business that encompasses other businesses remains). So I could be pinko

I tend to get along more with Socialists than Communists. It doesnt mean I agree with them. I just see a bit more common ground with them than I do Communists. Some say Socialism is the same as Communism, but I disagree.Even Marx said that Socialism and Communism are different. Then again, Marx is a bit over rated if you ask me. It didnt take long for people (er...dictators more like it) to start changing his ideas and then adding their names to it.

The people are the worst of all dictators, because none of us is so cruel as all of us.

Marx is very overrated. And say what you will about stalin, I respect him (and agree that he could have done things better). Example of stalin's economic principles: Russia has too many people to support the change from agricultural russia to industrial russia: Use the people as expendable cannon fodder.

My solutions are aimed along a longer term and his were aimed at a (very) short term. But then, I don't have to prop up totalitarianism just to stay in power

First line is merely a statement of fact for Progressives. I have added a bit more information to the intro page since you have posted. What you read was my basic to get the page started. I plan on upgrading the introduction page every now and then.

RIghto, I'll probably take a disagreeing socialistic position in the interest of further developing both of our ideals

Progressives are NOT Anarchists! We are anti-authoritarian, not anti-government. We feel that social laws should be kept to a bare minimum, and those laws should only protect the life, liberty, and property of society as individuals and as a whole regardless of wether they share the majority social views and beliefs or not. We feel that economic laws should also be kept to a moderate level to protect the welfare of each citizen and the reasonable ecology of their environment.

If a government is an overseeing body that has any control over anything... how can a government not be authoritarian? At least in a minor capacity, it must be.

I have a rather unique understanding of ownership... if you ask someone else to protect a thing for you: it isn't yours. If you ask this of a government, you have stated that it is the government which owns a thing, and that you would be grateful if they let you use it.

Do you progressives draw the line of life at the point of its 'conception' like moronic anti-abortionists, or do you wait until a human can survive without leeching on a mother from inside?

How can you protect liberty with laws? Anarchists are the only ones who actually believe in liberty, i find (I do not, btw). Every other position contains statements of what you are not allowed to do.

The rest is good, though why believe each citizen to be worthy of said protection (ie: criminals of high value crimes).

Progressives ARE Modern Liberals and Social Liberals! Some on the authoritarian right wing have claimed that Liberals hide behind the name "Progressive" so that they do not have to reveal that they are liberal because they think the word "liberal" is a negative and hated word. In reality the word "Progressive" has been historically used as the name of choice by Social Liberals since the later half of the 20th century in Western Civilization. Some right wingers have tried to take the name "Progressive" hoping to ride its popularity. Progressives are historically left wing.

:wave: I think 'liberal' is a negative and hatable word that is copiously misused. Anarchy is the most awful of all systems, and I find it fascinating just how temporary it really is.

No, Progressives are Captialists who oppose aggresive corporatism, or corporatism in general, specifically the union between the corrupt politician and the corrupt corporation. Progressives are NOT socialists, they are what I like to call "soft capitalists", meaning that they frown upon the "cut throat capitalism" where people make profit from ruining the lives of others. I would go so far as to say most Progressives do not consider clean water, basic food, basic education, and basic shelter to be Capitalised. In other words, Progressives stand strong for a basic "survival net" for society to keep it from regressing to past social systems such as Feudalism, Slavery, and Serfism. Progressives want a profit motive to keep good ideas flowing, but do not consider it the end all be all of society. Progressives will say "workers of the world, unite!" but do so under the banner of Capitalism, not Communism. Progressive are socially anti-authoritarian, and economically moderate left.

So... progressives are capitalists with socialistic policies (the 'survival net'). Seems that socialists can have a progressive stance on their socialism easily. But it seems I am right: progressives are misguided socialists Please don't take that seriously, I say it in jest

Void is smart. Very smart. I've got a lot of respect for him and you Sae. I will put my foot down and say that Fascism isnt any where near Socialism. Fascism glorified and legitimized the war pigs and the war profiteers and claimed it under "the workers" for "socialism". Sort of like how some right wing groups ride the popularity of the name "Progressive" to get into power in some countries. The only thing "progressive" about them is their party name.

Though I do favor a steel fist guiding a country and also favor taking territory by force (again), most (all?) of my other policies are cleanly on the left.

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[reverendjeremiah]

Authoritarianism is a form of social organization characterized by submission to authority. It is opposed to individualism and democracy. In politics, an authoritarian government is one in which political power is concentrated in a leader or leaders, typically unelected by the people, who possess exclusive, unaccountable, and arbitrary power. Authoritarianism differs from totalitarianism in that social and economic institutions exist that are not under the government's control

Authoritarianism is characterized by highly concentrated, and centralized power maintained by political repression and the exclusion of potential challengers. It uses political parties and mass organizations to mobilize people around the goals of the state.[3]

Authoritarianism emphases the rule of man over the rule of law, it includes election rigging, political decisions being made by a select group of unelected officials behind closed doors, a bureaucracy that operates independently of rules, which does not properly supervise elected officials, and fails to serve the concerns of the constituencies they purportedly serve. Authoritarianism also embraces the informal and unregulated exercise of political power, a leadership that is "self-appointed and even if elected cannot be displaced by citizens' free choice among competitors," the arbitrary deprivation of civil liberties, and little tolerance for meaningful opposition


Why didnt she understand "Authoritarian", yet speak of Stalin in the same post? Methinks she is trying to test me.

Do you progressives draw the line of life at the point of its 'conception' like moronic anti-abortionists, or do you wait until a human can survive without leeching on a mother from inside?

We debate it here and there. But most of us disagree with the "conception" line. As far as I am concerned a woman can terminate her pregnancy any time she wants. Some do the "leaching" or "Pain" thing. We oppose making abortion illegal, and for the most part try to give as much freedom to the woman as possible.

I have a rather unique understanding of ownership... if you ask someone else to protect a thing for you: it isn't yours. If you ask this of a government, you have stated that it is the government which owns a thing, and that you would be grateful if they let you use it.

Well, if you want to get all philosophical on me, as far as I am concerned, nobody really owns ANYTHING, especially their own lives.

That doesnt bode well for society

So property must be protected. There is nothing wrong with protecting things, and society as a whole protecting things as well. I know how you feel about "rights", but I allow you the right to question them, and I will protect your right to do so. See? Thats how it works. Then we all get along and not stab, rape, and murder each other.

Criminal are a different story. Treating our criminals with kindness is a mark of a beneficial society. Surely you can see that..well, maybe you cant.

So... progressives are capitalists with socialistic policies (the 'survival net'). Seems that socialists can have a progressive stance on their socialism easily. But it seems I am right: progressives are misguided socialists Please don't take that seriously, I say it in jest

Thats okay Sae. The word "socialism" doesnt scare me. Democratic Socialists and I get along just fine, with a few disagreements of course. I might even talk them into sparing your life once they find out what you have REALLY been doing all these years.