(February 11, 2011 at 7:07 pm)Chuck Wrote:

(February 11, 2011 at 5:01 pm)muhtesem insan Wrote:

(February 11, 2011 at 1:55 pm)Chuck Wrote:

(February 11, 2011 at 12:47 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Trusting the military is almost always a mistake.

Were it not for the secular military, Turkey today would be like Algeria.

that's not true. Islamism is stronger thanks to "secular military"

Let's not forget who set the secular base line here. Current mild resurgence of "Islamism" in Turkey may seem like a reaction to military domination, but it was the military who set the base line of secularism in Turkey against which the resurgence is even noticed. Were it not for the military, the baseline in modern Turkey would not have been such a secular society. Instead it would have been a much more backward and Islamic country to start with.

No one set the secular base line. Turkish modernisation dates back to 18th century. It started with limited military and organisational reforms and real transformation started with Tanzimat. It created a group of modern thinking intellectuals in Turkey. After Anatolian revolution Mustafa Kemal fastened this modernisation process. It continued till end of 40's, after -US supported- democratic party elected more islamic elements of the country started to stenghten again. After a relatively democratic constution created after 1960 coup. Communism started to become popular. For an ally of USA which borders with USSR it was unacceptable. After a -US led- coup in 1971 both islamism and nationalism is supported aginst internationalist and infidel communists. But it wasn't enough and another -US led- coup made in 1980 and made turkey a true fascist state. After this coup made by "secular military" religious studies become a required course (by constution) for all primary (after 4th grade), middle and high schools, anti-evolution thought promoted by education department, religous schools opened everywhere as an alternative to secular schools...etc. Military is the main force of islamisation of Turkey.

It'll be nicer for the two of you to avoid the quote-vortexing, btw.

Chuck Wrote:This state of affairs is made possible largely by $1.4 billion of annual US aid.

The US government is so hypocritical. They prop up dictators and false Governments to suit their own agenda, regardless of democratic rights and freedoms of the people concerned. Iraq, Egypt, & Bahrain are but a few examples.

They pose themselves as the pinacle of 'human rights' and 'freedoms', but in reality they are the cause of many of the Worlds probelms.

When things go wrong, they are the first to stand up and say the opposite to what they practice.

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As a matter of fact, the majority of the so called 'democratic' World does the same thing.

(February 20, 2011 at 10:09 pm)ib.me.ub Wrote:

Chuck Wrote:This state of affairs is made possible largely by $1.4 billion of annual US aid.

The US government is so hypocritical. They prop up dictators and false Governments to suit their own agenda, regardless of democratic rights and freedoms of the people concerned. Iraq, Egypt, & Bahrain are but a few examples.

They pose themselves as the pinacle of 'human rights' and 'freedoms', but in reality they are the cause of many of the Worlds probelms.

When things go wrong, they are the first to stand up and say the opposite to what they practice.

---

As a matter of fact, the majority of the so called 'democratic' World does the same thing.

Gee Whiz... you say that like it's a bad thing.

Democracy - Middle East Style.


Be careful what you wish for!


http://apnews.excite.com/article/2011030...ACT01.html

Quote:A protest by hundreds of Egyptian women demanding equal rights and an end to sexual harassment turned violent Tuesday when crowds of men heckled and shoved the demonstrators, telling them to go home where they belong.

The women - some in headscarves and flowing robes, others in jeans - had marched to Cairo's central Tahrir Square to celebrate International Women's Day. But crowds of men soon outnumbered them and chased them out.

(February 20, 2011 at 10:09 pm)ib.me.ub Wrote: The US government is so hypocritical. They prop up dictators and false Governments to suit their own agenda, regardless of democratic rights and freedoms of the people concerned. Iraq, Egypt, & Bahrain are but a few examples.

They pose themselves as the pinnacle of 'human rights' and 'freedoms', but in reality they are the cause of many of the Worlds problems.

Yeah, the US government is a hypocritical system that supported the occupation and corruption happening in Muslim lands.

The reason why America comes off more badly than other countries in the world who may also make deals with dictators should be obvious: its because the US preaches to the Muslims about being just and democratic (usually to condemn them and to justify invasion) while at the same time supporting the corruption in Muslim countries. Furthermore, the US is frequently engaged in aggressive foreign policies in the region (the two recent illegal invasions), propping up governments which remind the people of the Middle East about the hypocrisy of the US and their active involvement in undermining their countries while attempting to come across as legitimate brokers for peace. The US and its media are constantly talking about expanding and achieving "US interests in the region" as if they have a right to the region. This is the arrogance that the rest of the world recognizes in the US and the sad part is that most Americans don't even realize this.

The media wants to fool us into thinking that their choice for 'democracy' was their own choice (the Egyptians' choice), but yet, I've seen articles and videos on the internet which show proofs that the CIA was secretly planning for this while giving us the image that these revolutions were self-induced. It was first initiated in Tunisia by using the tools of social networking that the internet provides. It was then initiated in Egypt, Jordan, Yemen, and Algeria in order to get rid of tyrants who are no longer viable to the US. Once Mubarak was removed, the US-trained Egyptian military has swiftly taken control to assure that the country will remain its key Arab ally to Israel. The fact is that the US supports any dictatorship as long as she bows down to her wishes. If you don't believe me, see the links below:

1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmerjFQ4sx0

2. Egypt protests: America's secret backing for rebel leaders behind uprising