So what...? I'm not eternal, omnipotent, omniscient, and I can't create something from nothing......but I can still create things.  

OFC, you do realize that the abrahamic concept of a god -as- those things isn't unique as a concept of gods..yes?  That much was also borrowed from other pagans.  The abrahamic god started out as one limited god in a pantheon of other limited gods. The groups we retroactively call judea christian changed their god concept as they came up with better ideas and were introduced to better ideas through cultural transfer.

You're all still at it, today..though...now, you mostly borrow from the godless, rather than the godly. Not too many pagans left laying around, a state of affairs that the abrahamics might have had something to do with.

I'm not sure who you're referring to when you say "our" monotheistic beliefs.....I assume you're excluding the christians? Their god was made flesh, the god you cribbed your god from..... or haven't you heard the good news?

(December 4, 2018 at 5:00 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: So what...?   I'm not eternal, omnipotent, omniscient, and I can't create something from nothing......but I can still create things. 

That's why you can't be the God Who created this world.
 

Gay Bologna Wrote:OFC, you do realize that the abrahamic concept of a god -as- those things isn't unique as a concept of gods..yes?  That much was also borrowed from other pagans.  The abrahamic god started out as one limited god in a pantheon of other limited gods.  The groups we retroactively call judea christian changed their god concept as they came up with better ideas and were introduced to better ideas through cultural transfer.

You're all still at it, today..though...now, you mostly borrow from the godless, rather than the godly.  Not too many pagans left laying around, a state of affairs that the abrahamics might have had something to do with.

How did the Abrahamic God, i.e., Yahweh/Elohim/Alaha, start off as "limited"? Limited in what way? And what pantheon?

The first written record of this Abrahamic God - the Torah - describes Him thus:

טווְנִשְׁמַרְתֶּ֥ם מְאֹ֖ד לְנַפְשֹֽׁתֵיכֶ֑ם כִּ֣י לֹ֤א רְאִיתֶם֙ כָּל־תְּמוּנָ֔ה בְּי֗וֹם דִּבֶּ֨ר יְהֹוָ֧ה אֲלֵיכֶ֛ם בְּחֹרֵ֖ב מִתּ֥וֹךְ הָאֵֽשׁ:
And you shall watch yourselves very well, for you did not see any image on the day that the Lord spoke to you at Horeb from the midst of the fire.
Lest you become corrupt and make for yourselves a graven image, the representation of any form, the likeness of male or female, (Deut. 4:15-16)

Look it up for yourself...you probably shouldn't have to pester an atheist for shit you don't know about your own god...huh?

(December 4, 2018 at 5:14 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: Look it up for yourself...you probably shouldn't have to pester an atheist for shit you don't know about your own god...huh?

This is the same escape hatch through which you escaped last time when I asked for proof that Assyrian mythology influenced ancient Israelite religion

(December 4, 2018 at 5:11 pm)Cherub786 Wrote:

(December 4, 2018 at 5:00 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: So what...?   I'm not eternal, omnipotent, omniscient, and I can't create something from nothing......but I can still create things. 

That's why you can't be the God Who created this world.
 

Gay Bologna Wrote:OFC, you do realize that the abrahamic concept of a god -as- those things isn't unique as a concept of gods..yes?  That much was also borrowed from other pagans.  The abrahamic god started out as one limited god in a pantheon of other limited gods.  The groups we retroactively call judea christian changed their god concept as they came up with better ideas and were introduced to better ideas through cultural transfer.

You're all still at it, today..though...now, you mostly borrow from the godless, rather than the godly.  Not too many pagans left laying around, a state of affairs that the abrahamics might have had something to do with.

How did the Abrahamic God, i.e., Yahweh/Elohim/Alaha, start off as "limited"? Limited in what way? And what pantheon?

The first written record of this Abrahamic God - the Torah - describes Him thus:

טווְנִשְׁמַרְתֶּ֥ם מְאֹ֖ד לְנַפְשֹֽׁתֵיכֶ֑ם כִּ֣י לֹ֤א רְאִיתֶם֙ כָּל־תְּמוּנָ֔ה בְּי֗וֹם דִּבֶּ֨ר יְהֹוָ֧ה אֲלֵיכֶ֛ם בְּחֹרֵ֖ב מִתּ֥וֹךְ הָאֵֽשׁ:
And you shall watch yourselves very well, for you did not see any image on the day that the Lord spoke to you at Horeb from the midst of the fire.
Lest you become corrupt and make for yourselves a graven image, the representation of any form, the likeness of male or female, (Deut. 4:15-16)

(December 4, 2018 at 4:58 pm)Cherub786 Wrote: A common argument from atheists against the existence of God, specifically directed against monotheistic religions, is that why does the cosmological argument point to your specific God and not the gods of pagan religions like Hinduism, Norse mythology, Greek mythology, etc.

Firstly, most of those "gods" as conceived by those pagan religions are not believed to be the creator of the universe, but demigods that are not eternal, not omnipotent, not omniscient, and not possessing creative abilities to create something from nothing. In Hindu philosophy for example, it is believe the cosmos is eternal and that matter is eternal, which is perpetually reorganized and reshaped but never creatio ex nihilo. None of their gods has the ability to create ex nihilo.

Other religions like Mormonism hold the doctrine of "exaltation" that all the "gods" were once mortal and they became divine.

Furthermore, our monotheistic belief is that God has no physical limited form or image. It is reasonable to believe that if there is a God Who created the universe ex nihilo is a God that transcends anthropomorphic qualities and limited forms. The images of the pagan gods as conceived by their respective pagan religions are derived from human imagination. It is an example of man creating god in his image.

So if you look at Thor, Ram, Zeus, Krisna, Siva, Ganesh, and even Jesus, these are example of pagan "gods" that have human forms, bodies, and limitations which rule them out as being the One God that created the universe ex nihilo, and Who is unlimited, omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent.

Still doesn't fix the problem, buttnose. That it doesn't point to these other gods doesn't mean that it points to your god.

(December 4, 2018 at 5:16 pm)Cherub786 Wrote:

(December 4, 2018 at 5:14 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: Look it up for yourself...you probably shouldn't have to pester an atheist for shit you don't know about your own god...huh?

This is the same escape hatch through which you escaped last time when I asked for proof that Assyrian mythology influenced ancient Israelite religion

.................?  

I'm still here, we can have that conversation whenever you decide to educate yourself?  Do a little honest self appraisal...would it be better for you to self direct and find that information, or for me to tell you something you don't know..again?  Don't you think it's likely that you'd feel an urge to say "nuh-uh" on pure account of my having been the person who informed you?    

We could roll the tape on other instances of my having related some fact to you to see how that goes down......I think we'll spot a pattern..lelz.

So...again, if you want to know that thing....go...look....it.....up.

(December 4, 2018 at 5:20 pm)Bucky Ball Wrote:

(December 4, 2018 at 5:11 pm)Cherub786 Wrote: That's why you can't be the God Who created this world.
 

How did the Abrahamic God, i.e., Yahweh/Elohim/Alaha, start off as "limited"? Limited in what way? And what pantheon?

The first written record of this Abrahamic God - the Torah - describes Him thus:

טווְנִשְׁמַרְתֶּ֥ם מְאֹ֖ד לְנַפְשֹֽׁתֵיכֶ֑ם כִּ֣י לֹ֤א רְאִיתֶם֙ כָּל־תְּמוּנָ֔ה בְּי֗וֹם דִּבֶּ֨ר יְהֹוָ֧ה אֲלֵיכֶ֛ם בְּחֹרֵ֖ב מִתּ֥וֹךְ הָאֵֽשׁ:
And you shall watch yourselves very well, for you did not see any image on the day that the Lord spoke to you at Horeb from the midst of the fire.
Lest you become corrupt and make for yourselves a graven image, the representation of any form, the likeness of male or female, (Deut. 4:15-16)

Actually that is not the first written record of Yahweh Sabaoth.
He's one of the sons (brother of the moon god "Sin" who turned into Allah, later) of El Elyon from the Babylonian pantheon.
He was the war god ... "The Lord of Hosts" ... a "host" is an army in battle formation.
Yahweh had a wife/consort ... Ashera, who was worshipped in some centers.. Dan, Beth-El, and Jerusalem.

"When Elyon divided the nations, when he separated the sons of Adam, he established the borders of the nations according to the number of the sons of the gods. Yahweh’s portion was his people, [Israel] his allotted inheritance. (Deut. 32:8–9) ... Early Hebrews were polytheistic, and they picked the war god, as they wanted help in their battles.
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/crossexami...ceded-him/
https://www.haaretz.com/archaeology/.pre...-1.5392677

The idea, probably originated in the Sumerian myth system, (it was found as one of the 70 sons of El Elyon), in the Enuma Elish, (the Sumerian Creation myth), found in the Royal Library in Ashurbanipal, by archaeologists, near ancient Nineveh.  , in the mid 1800's.

In which ancient text is it written that Yahweh had a consort (Ashera) and is that text older than the Torah?

Magic book is the MCU comic of ANE religion.

New Magic Book is a greek crossover.

Newer Magic Book is the arab language version with fresh IP test bubbles.

Your religion...specifically, is a fanfic nerd-feud turned bloody.