(May 16, 2019 at 12:24 am)onlinebiker Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 11:00 pm)Amarok Wrote: I think your thinking of yourself

Holy shit.

I've been insulted by a 6 year old.


How shall I ever recover?

I was just lower my insults to a level you could comprehend

(May 16, 2019 at 7:38 am)LastPoet Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 7:59 pm)onlinebiker Wrote: That' s moronic.

9mm is an old, (over 100 years) underpowered cartridge. It's use by military is mainly due to one factor - availability.

It is suitable for self defense use because it' s compact - and doesn't require a massive frame to handle the pressures involved.

But " military grade"?

Sure, but what do you think of the rules to get a gun here? I am no enthusiast, so to me they are pointless.

Not sell to criminals? Good idea - make it easy for the law abiding to spot them.

Psych evals? A waste of time and money. Not selling guns to psychos? Great. Again - make it easy for the same people to spot them.

(May 15, 2019 at 10:06 am)Brian37 Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 9:45 am)CDF47 Wrote: I disagree for the reasons I previously posted.

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Stay away from our assault weapons. 

By the way, nearly everyone has anxiety to some extent.  It is part of our design.  

I totally disagree with many of the new proposed regulations you make.

Hey buttwipe, the INVENTOR of the Ar-15 said he never intended on it being used for civilian use. THE FUCKING INVENTOR!

You want a weapon of war, fucking serve. But I don't want my neighborhood turned into a fucking battlefield. We are not landing on the beaches of Normandy.

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(May 15, 2019 at 9:32 am)CDF47 Wrote: It's not about keeping toys.

You are correct, it is not about keeping toys. However, IT IS ABOUT MONEY! The makers of firearms are like any CEO, their job is to keep their market and expand their market and keep and gain shareholders.  This isn't about rights for the CEOs of these companies, it is about MARKETING!

The makers are pulling the same fear mongering bullshit car companies did when Nadar told them their products suck. But funny that, regulations have made cars safer. But big oil is also selling fear too, trying to avoid the fact that burning fossil fuels is causing global warming.

MARKETING, not rights, but selling fear to people like you so they can keep their profit margins up.

"Consider your man card issued" isn't about rights, it is marketing a fantasy implying the mere ownership of a firearm will magically turn you into Rambo.

^^^^^ That is marketing a serious tool as if it were merely a toy. Firearms are not toys and should not be marketed as if they were.

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Firearms have no magic powers, and more often than not, the user is far more likely to hurt themselves or someone they are familiar with than they would successfully use it against a complete stranger.

It has everything to do with the 2nd amendment right.  Of course companies are trying to make money and there is some fear mongering but in the end they won't get our guns anyway.  It is a concern of mine but I don't see it happening.  There would be a war in this country if they came for the guns.  Many people are too smart for that.

Perhaps a "gun" patch they have to wear to help with the ID.

(May 15, 2019 at 11:02 am)Drich Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 8:57 am)Figbash Wrote:

are you not reading the previous posts?

THEY ARE THE SAME PEOPLE!

The Group lion was talking about are active duty ARMY POLICE ECT who vow NOT to disarm fellow citizens!

So put a pic of the fire team with the howitzer next to a pic of clinton and ask who will win? That is the conflict.

I know, it sucks even thinking about a war in this country.

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(May 15, 2019 at 11:07 am)Aegon Wrote: Lately I've been thinking about how societies deal with inevitability. By "inevitability," I mean something that people will continue to do in that society no matter how hard they regulate it. I think about drug use, something that humans love to do and won't stop just because it's illegal.

Instead of pushing for intense gun control, we launch an aggressive public information campaign, like we did with cigarettes. We have graphic advertisements about what happens when you are careless with your firearms, and what horrors occur when firearms get in the wrong hands. Most of all, this campaign makes the assumption that gun-owners are responsible, and that they're not inherently bad for owning them. We eliminate that lifestyle divide by having these people's distrust of government and love for guns as an inevitability. "You're not a real American if you don't lock your guns," or some crap like that.

I still think some gun control measures should be passed, but only in tandem with efforts like that.

Locking guns up is great but how are you going to have time to get to it in a defensive situation.  Need a quick opening device to quickly get to a secured firearm.

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(May 15, 2019 at 11:12 am)Drich Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 10:06 am)Brian37 Wrote: Hey buttwipe, the INVENTOR of the Ar-15 said he never intended on it being used for civilian use. THE FUCKING INVENTOR!

eugene stoner sport that was the inventor of the Ar-10 which used the nato 7.65x29 natoround then they made a sporting rifle just for cilivian and police use it was known as THE AR 15 STUPID T-What! That ONLY INTENDED USE OF the AR-15 was for civilian use. IT was then modified to mil-spec by the army which converted to assault rifle status and redesignated this new assault rifle as the M-16, then again modified for close quarter combat in a carbine form as the m-4.
So again stupid people, ALL AR-15s are semi automatic NON assault rifles that where purposely made for civilian use.
Educate yourself fools!
ArmaLite, then a division of the Fairchild Aircraft Corporation. When first introduced in 1956, the AR-10 used an innovative straight-line barrel/stock design with phenolic composite and forged alloy parts resulting in a small arm significantly easier to control in automatic fire and over 1 lb (0.45 kg) lighter than other infantry rifles of the day.[1] Over its production life, the original AR-10 was built in relatively small numbers, with fewer than 9,900 rifles assembled. However, the ArmaLite AR-10 would become the progenitor for a wide range of firearms.

In 1957, the basic AR-10 design was rescaled and substantially modified by ArmaLite to accommodate the .223 Remingtoncartridge, and given the designation ArmaLite AR-15.[2] In 1959, ArmaLite sold its rights to the AR-10 and AR-15 to Colt Firearms due to financial difficulties, and limitations in terms of manpower and production capacity.[3] After modifications (most notably, the charging handle was re-located from under the carrying handle like AR-10 to the rear of the receiver), the new redesigned rifle was subsequently adopted by the U.S. military as the M16 Rifle.[4][5][6] Colt continued to use the AR-15 trademark for its line of semi-automatic-only rifles, which it marketed to civilian and law-enforcement customers as the Colt AR-15. With the expiration of its patent, other manufacturers began producing their own variants, known as AR-15 style rifles.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ArmaLite_AR-10

Very informative post.  Some of that I was aware of, some was new to me.  I just bought an AR-15 last month.  It is a Colt AR.

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(May 15, 2019 at 11:25 am)Brian37 Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 11:18 am)Drich Wrote: law abiding gun owners do not need to betold. the burden of gun ownership weighs heavily on people's minds when ever they leave their homes or have company over or even worse kids. there is no peace for a lawful gun owner if their guns are not secured. and those are the people a propaganda campaign would most directly influence. It is the monsters who do not care or seek guns to do ill that make it unsafe for everyone else. most of them have guns illegally now, so what are more laws going to do? what will a propaganda campaign do?

Holy crap. I am so sick of this bullshit argument. My dad who got drunk and shot his 38 with me in the room, in a tiny townhouse, had no criminal record and legally purchased his firearms. Having no record at the time of buy does not prevent the buyer from doing stupid shit, hurting themselves or others, after a legal buy.

The Virginia Tech shooter had no criminal record when he legally purchased his firearms, but he was mentally ill, and never should have been allowed to buy them.

VETTING at time of sale is not a gun grab, it is simply insuring that the person who legally buys it isn't going to get violent after that legal buy. Prevention is not oppression, anymore than requiring a pilot to get licence before they fly a passenger jet.

It is bullshit to say "Only criminals will get them". Most firearm deaths start out with a legally purchased firearm.

Mental health gun laws are a way to disarm Americans.

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(May 15, 2019 at 2:11 pm)LastPoet Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 1:31 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: I think it's important to distinguished between 'law abiding gun owner' and 'responsible gun owner'.  One can be lawful and still be irresponsible
I linked to a story a little over a month ago in which a woman in the US left a handgun accessible to a four year old who shot and killed his six year old sister.  The mum faced no charges. 

Boru

My almost 3 year old is one of a curious mind. Keeping bleach, assorted torture devices, etc out of reach is a pain as it is. My grandpa gave me his 12 gauge shotgun, horizontal paired barrels. I wouldn't pass the psych exam anyway. So I gave it away to be destroyed, by the cops so they say. I have a galvanized 3/4 inch pipe under my pillow. SO if you walk into my home and me being aware, the pipe works better.

No way a pipe works better than a shotgun for home defense.

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(May 15, 2019 at 3:55 pm)Amarok Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 8:37 am)CDF47 Wrote: The founding fathers made it a right to bear arms that shall not be infringed to prevent tyrannical governments from taking power primarily.  Also, guns are to protect against potential invaders.  They also serve to deter and defend against thugs and criminals that would get guns regardless of the laws.  If the totalitarians in this country ever really went for the guns, I expect there might be a war in this country.  

1. It never has but it has put plenty of them in power 

2. No invader is scared of you pea shooter 

3. So your justifying guns by saying criminals won't follow the law . Think that logic through.

4.Nope because none of you pussies have the balls to start a war because you know your band of weekend warriors would get stomped

Pea shooter, LOL. Did you ever see what buck shot does or slugs or 5.56 NATO rounds?

No, none of us want a war in this country.

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(May 15, 2019 at 7:59 pm)onlinebiker Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 12:09 pm)LastPoet Wrote: Here in Portugal, you have to take a course, have no criminal record, pass a psych eval and renew these from time to time to buy or own a gun. 9 mils are forbidden completely to the public (military grade weaponry).

Gun crimes here are very low.

That' s moronic.

9mm is an old, (over 100 years) underpowered cartridge. It's use by military is mainly due to one factor - availability.

It is suitable for self defense use because it' s compact - and doesn't require a massive frame to handle the pressures involved.

But " military grade"?

With some Federal HST ammo or Hornady Critical Duty or Gold Dot Speer ammo and a 9mm is a very lethal firearm.

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(May 16, 2019 at 8:46 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Perhaps a "gun" patch they have to wear to help with the ID.

What are you proposing.  A gun patch?

(May 16, 2019 at 8:46 am)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 10:06 am)Brian37 Wrote: Hey buttwipe, the INVENTOR of the Ar-15 said he never intended on it being used for civilian use. THE FUCKING INVENTOR!

You want a weapon of war, fucking serve. But I don't want my neighborhood turned into a fucking battlefield. We are not landing on the beaches of Normandy.

---

You are correct, it is not about keeping toys. However, IT IS ABOUT MONEY! The makers of firearms are like any CEO, their job is to keep their market and expand their market and keep and gain shareholders.  This isn't about rights for the CEOs of these companies, it is about MARKETING!

The makers are pulling the same fear mongering bullshit car companies did when Nadar told them their products suck. But funny that, regulations have made cars safer. But big oil is also selling fear too, trying to avoid the fact that burning fossil fuels is causing global warming.

MARKETING, not rights, but selling fear to people like you so they can keep their profit margins up.

"Consider your man card issued" isn't about rights, it is marketing a fantasy implying the mere ownership of a firearm will magically turn you into Rambo.

^^^^^ That is marketing a serious tool as if it were merely a toy. Firearms are not toys and should not be marketed as if they were.

---

Firearms have no magic powers, and more often than not, the user is far more likely to hurt themselves or someone they are familiar with than they would successfully use it against a complete stranger.

It has everything to do with the 2nd amendment right.  Of course companies are trying to make money and there is some fear mongering but in the end they won't get our guns anyway.  It is a concern of mine but I don't see it happening.  There would be a war in this country if they came for the guns.  Many people are too smart for that.

Firearms ARE NOT LIVING HUMANS DUMBASS!

Humans have rights, objects do not have rights. I am sorry someone scared the shit out of you and painted safety advocates as evil. We are not evil for pointing out the vile marking of the makers using fear to pit you against me. GROW THE FUCK UP. Nobody wants a war asshole. 

You remember this bullshit the next time a school, or bar, or business office gets shot up.

Prevention is not oppression.

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Australia is not a dictatorship. NZ is not a dictatorship. Japan is not a dictatorship. Canada is not a dictatorship. England is not a dictatorship. They are all our allies and also free and open pluralistic societies. If they can do it, we can too.

(May 16, 2019 at 8:47 am)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 15, 2019 at 11:07 am)Aegon Wrote: Lately I've been thinking about how societies deal with inevitability. By "inevitability," I mean something that people will continue to do in that society no matter how hard they regulate it. I think about drug use, something that humans love to do and won't stop just because it's illegal.

Instead of pushing for intense gun control, we launch an aggressive public information campaign, like we did with cigarettes. We have graphic advertisements about what happens when you are careless with your firearms, and what horrors occur when firearms get in the wrong hands. Most of all, this campaign makes the assumption that gun-owners are responsible, and that they're not inherently bad for owning them. We eliminate that lifestyle divide by having these people's distrust of government and love for guns as an inevitability. "You're not a real American if you don't lock your guns," or some crap like that.

I still think some gun control measures should be passed, but only in tandem with efforts like that.

Locking guns up is great but how are you going to have time to get to it in a defensive situation.  Need a quick opening device to quickly get to a secured firearm.

Do you live in an area where your apartment or home are in constant threat? I lived in a moderately high-crime area in D.C. and I didn't even feel that way.

(May 16, 2019 at 9:22 am)Aegon Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 8:47 am)CDF47 Wrote: Locking guns up is great but how are you going to have time to get to it in a defensive situation.  Need a quick opening device to quickly get to a secured firearm.

Do you live in an area where your apartment or home are in constant threat? I lived in a moderately high-crime area in D.C. and I didn't even feel that way.

Fear sells. It's what the NRA and religion have in common.

Not all firearm owners blindly worship a firearm as if it has magic powers. Nobody wants to ban 100% of all firearms. But we are tired of one industry holding the nation hostage just to protect it's sales.

(May 16, 2019 at 9:24 am)Fierce Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 9:22 am)Aegon Wrote: Do you live in an area where your apartment or home are in constant threat? I lived in a moderately high-crime area in D.C. and I didn't even feel that way.

Fear sells. It's what the NRA and religion have in common.

The FUD Factor* is all they have. For their market it's enough. They do hammer on it.


*Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt.