I can close my eyes and in 2 seconds imagine a world infinitely better than this in virtually every way, for everyone in it. If I can imagine it that easily, but the big man can't/wont do it, we have a problem.

(December 21, 2014 at 12:19 pm)abaris Wrote:

(December 21, 2014 at 12:13 pm)Drich Wrote: It is completely on God to provide continuity of Scripture if He certifies continuity of scripture in the book itself (which He does.) That or He must offer forgiveness for following an incomplete or book in error, or He must confirm or make changes to scripture in an authoritiave way as per the discovery of something like the Dead Sea scrolls.

See, that only works, if you're willingly accept the earth only to be some thousands years old. If you're not, and I'm certainly not willing to accept that, god would have to be one of the most lazy bastards ever to exist. Billions of years and he only bothers to make an appearance some 3000 years ago. To some half nomadic desert dwellers with no culture to speak of compared to the empires sourrounding them at the time.

Who says?
I don't believe the earth is some thousand years old.
http://atheistforums.org/thread-14190.html

Also who says he only made one appearance? Maybe this is the only one that took.

(December 21, 2014 at 12:36 pm)robvalue Wrote: I can close my eyes and in 2 seconds imagine a world infinitely better than this in virtually every way, for everyone and in it. If I can imagine it that easily, but the big man can't/wont do it, we have a problem.

Or if he/it just doesn't bother, which was my long time position after I left christianity behind. When I thought of something like god, I imagined some neutral uncaring force governing the universe.

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(December 21, 2014 at 12:39 pm)Drich Wrote: I don't believe the earth is some thousand years old.
http://atheistforums.org/thread-14190.html

Also who says he only made one appearance? Maybe this is the only one that took.

Same shit. You believe in Adam. I never did and never will.

Also it's pitiful for an all powerful being to take several attempts to present itself. Even more pitiful, if the chosen people turns out to be not that civilized compared to contemporaries.

If you've got to hit rock bottom before he'll come to you, it isn't worth it. It isn't about him wanting to be your friend and provider. It's about him wanting you to need him, which is self serving. Not that we don't already know the god of the bible is a narcissist.

(December 21, 2014 at 12:13 pm)Drich Wrote: It is completely on God to provide continuity of Scripture if He certifies continuity of scripture in the book itself (which He does.)

Which book?

(December 21, 2014 at 12:13 pm)Drich Wrote: That or He must offer forgiveness for following an incomplete or book in error, or He must confirm or make changes to scripture in an authoritiave way as per the discovery of something like the Dead Sea scrolls.

To put it simply, "we" don't have to ensure sola scriptura, that's God's job. Either that or forgive us for following sola scriptura as that is what we have been told to believe/follow per the bible itself.

Unless my version was missing a divinely inspired preface, the Bible never states, "All sixty books here included are God's words."

You're relying on humans (who first wrote the books and then later canonized them) to decide for you which books are divine and which are not. Obviously, that's all you can do as your God lacks any obligation to perform jobs for us since, you know, he's no more real than Poseidon.

I used to be a Christian. My faith was important to me and something that I took for granted. In my forties, I began to have serious doubts and nothing that I could do would stop those doubts. Actually, at one point in my life I would get down on my face and beg god not to harden my heart. Questioning was traumatic for me and not something I asked to do. Every night I read my bible and my doubts grew.

The final straw came when my adolescent, learning disabled son got his girlfriend pregnant. We had given them birth control because we knew that they were sexually active even though my son-for whatever reason- told us that he wasn't having sex. So yeah, I was disappointed in him and it was that disappointment that clicked something in my head. Never would I want my son to suffer because he upset me. There is nothing that he could do that would make me turn against him. He could try to kill me or hate me and I would still love him and want what was best for him. The god that I worshiped wanted people to go to a place of eternal misery because they didn't love him enough. He was supposed to be a parental figure and yet, I, the faulty human was a far better parent then he was.

At that point, I stopped believing and it stopped hurting that I didn't have belief any longer. So when Drich starts that nonsense about just believing I take offense.

Poseidon isn't real!?

(December 21, 2014 at 1:03 pm)Chad32 Wrote: Poseidon isn't real!?

I have to admit, I would love it if Loki was real.

(December 21, 2014 at 1:03 pm)Nope Wrote: We had given them birth control because we knew that they were sexually active even though my son-for whatever reason- told us that he wasn't having sex.

Probably because that's what you wanted to hear. It's not that easy for an adolescent son to talk to his mom about sex. And I speak from personal experience as a former adolescent son.

(December 21, 2014 at 1:06 pm)abaris Wrote:

(December 21, 2014 at 1:03 pm)Nope Wrote: We had given them birth control because we knew that they were sexually active even though my son-for whatever reason- told us that he wasn't having sex.

Probably because that's what you wanted to hear. It's not that easy for an adolescent son to talk to his mom about sex. And I speak from personal experience as a former adolescent son.

Yeah, I know that plus he was always more shy then my other children.