(December 22, 2014 at 4:24 am)robvalue Wrote: Did anyone believe me when I talked on the phone to God?

It sure sounded like you, my son.

Oh wow, is that you? You've been spying on the forum huh! What do you think of your apologetics?

One thing Drich and I agree on it seems is that there is no loving being looking after this planet.

Maybe he's worshipping satan then? Begging him to be less cruel? That would make a lot more sense than usual Christianity actually.

(December 21, 2014 at 9:33 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: I suspect Atheists who become Christians see holy beauty in the Bible and attributed it to holy spirit. I think it's possible to get this relative experience and can relate to it as that's what I use to get reading the Quran.

I can only think of small fractions of the Bible that would inspire a normal person. Isaiah has some inspiring sentiments. Some of the words of Jesus are inspiring. Psalms is o.k. I always liked Ecclesiastes.

Most of the Bible is incredibly boring, confusing, and repulsive IMO.

(December 22, 2014 at 5:47 am)robvalue Wrote: Oh wow, is that you? You've been spying on the forum huh! What do you think of your apologetics?

One thing Drich and I agree on it seems is that there is no loving being looking after this planet.

Maybe he's worshipping satan then? Begging him to be less cruel? That would make a lot more sense than usual Christianity actually.

Satan in the Old Testament is a good guy and the biblical god is a murdering, jealous nut.

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(December 22, 2014 at 3:45 am)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote:

(December 21, 2014 at 1:40 pm)Nope Wrote: Satan is the god of the planet?

Can you back up with scripture that Satan by default is running the planet because I have never read that in the bible.

How about Ephesians 2:1-3 CEV) = "1 In the past you were dead because you sinned and fought against God. 2 You followed the ways of this world and obeyed the devil. He rules the world, and his spirit has power over everyone who doesn’t obey God. 3 Once we were also ruled by the selfish desires of our bodies and minds. We had made God angry, and we were going to be punished like everyone else."

I raise you a Psalms 22 verse 28

28For the kingdom is the LORD'S And He rules over the nations.

Or Psalms 47

For God is the King of all the earth; sing to him a psalm of praise.

At least you came up with an appropriate verse. That is far more then Drich does.

(December 22, 2014 at 10:18 am)Nope Wrote:

(December 22, 2014 at 5:47 am)robvalue Wrote: Oh wow, is that you? You've been spying on the forum huh! What do you think of your apologetics?

One thing Drich and I agree on it seems is that there is no loving being looking after this planet.

Maybe he's worshipping satan then? Begging him to be less cruel? That would make a lot more sense than usual Christianity actually.

Satan in the Old Testament is a good guy and the biblical god is a murdering, jealous nut.

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(December 22, 2014 at 3:45 am)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote: How about Ephesians 2:1-3 CEV) = "1 In the past you were dead because you sinned and fought against God. 2 You followed the ways of this world and obeyed the devil. He rules the world, and his spirit has power over everyone who doesn’t obey God. 3 Once we were also ruled by the selfish desires of our bodies and minds. We had made God angry, and we were going to be punished like everyone else."

I raise you a Psalms 22 verse 28

28For the kingdom is the LORD'S And He rules over the nations.

Or Psalms 47

For God is the King of all the earth; sing to him a psalm of praise.

At least you came up with an appropriate verse. That is far more then Drich does.

Yeah from what i am gathering on it. No one should be following the NT and the fact satan turned into the bad guy is just a good laugh because he was never meant to be a bad guy. The OT still applies to christians yet they ignore and only follow the NT even though they are going against their savior doing so.

(December 21, 2014 at 10:38 pm)Drich Wrote:
Awesome try!

If you are getting hung up on the word/name lucifer, substitute it for 'satan.' Is from the hebrew word "Satan" which means the supernatural oppsition to God.

(You can use this word interchangably.)

I think you misunderstood my post or didn't actually read it.

In a nutshell, why would Isaiah speak of Mount Zaphon instead of Mount Zion when he is referring to God? Obviously Baal Hadad was the god of whoever wrote that passage in Isaiah. That passage was probably written during or after the Babylonian exile, because it is prophesying against the king of Babylon, so it demonstrates that the Israelites did not worship Yahweh until after the Babylonian exile. Most historians think that the OT was spliced and edited into its current form when the Israelites returned from Mesopotamia.

(December 21, 2014 at 10:36 am)watchamadoodle Wrote: I was reading some articles about athests who became Christians yesterday. I can't understand how an atheist who has researched the arguments is able to believe in Christianity.

The reasons why people convert are many and varied. That being said, just because a person is known for being rational at one point doesn't mean that every decision they make will always be rational.

When my husband died, because he was so famous and known for not being a believer, many people would come up to me-it still sometimes happens-and ask me if Carl changed at the end and converted to a belief in an afterlife. They also frequently ask me if I think I will see him again. Carl faced his death with unflagging courage and never sought refuge in illusions. The tragedy was that we knew we would never see each other again. I don’t ever expect to be reunited with Carl. But, the great thing is that when we were together, for nearly twenty years, we lived with a vivid appreciation of how brief and precious life is. We never trivialized the meaning of death by pretending it was anything other than a final parting. Every single moment that we were alive and we were together was miraculous-not miraculous in the sense of inexplicable or supernatural. We knew we were beneficiaries of chance. . . . That pure chance could be so generous and so kind. . . . That we could find each other, as Carl wrote so beautifully in Cosmos, you know, in the vastness of space and the immensity of time. . . . That we could be together for twenty years. That is something which sustains me and it’s much more meaningful. . . . The way he treated me and the way I treated him, the way we took care of each other and our family, while he lived. That is so much more important than the idea I will see him someday. I don’t think I’ll ever see Carl again. But I saw him. We saw each other. We found each other in the cosmos, and that was wonderful.

Ann Druyan the wife of Carl Sagan worte this after his death. I think it's beautiful but at the same time sad. Sad that two well educated people could not see any farther then the end of their noses, they had NO hope, no vision.

Errrr.... what? I have no idea what you're saying.

It is indeed beautiful, and summarizes how I feel about life. It's special and valuable because it is temporary, not just some trial run.

Jumping to unjustified conclusions about an afterlife is just cheap comfort, it doesn't change anything, except maybe leading to complacency.

(December 22, 2014 at 11:43 am)strawdawg Wrote: ...
Ann Druyan the wife of Carl Sagan worte this after his death. I think it's beautiful but at the same time sad. Sad that two well educated people could not see any farther then the end of their noses, they had NO hope, no vision.

I suspect death of yourself or a loved one is painful regardless of your belief or disbelief in an afterlife.