(March 24, 2015 at 11:55 am)professor Wrote: Julia, one of those promises God made to Israel was that He was going to boot them out of their land (because they were so bad)

That's the point.
Not a very reliable eternal covenant. Looks more like how the US Gov't treated the plains natives... Until the sky falls and the mountain is torn asunder....or until I feel like it, whichever comes first.
And it's not like Ol' Omniscient couldn't see it coming. He's the one that set up the whole system in the first place. No backtalk, no options.
He didn't say, "OK Abraham, I shall make of you a great nation...If that's ok with you?" No, the whole thing was a done deal from the beginning.
Besides
You're assuming the veracity of the text without corroboration. Most likely explanation: post-hoc rationalization by the losers.

Quote:As for the great deceiver and God being responsible for his deceptions. Good luck on that one.
You might take it up with Him. If you do that humbly, you will get an answer.

Same as asking the milk bottle: yes, no or not yet. I get better answers from my magic eight ball.

(March 23, 2015 at 6:50 am)AtlasS2 Wrote: If God had a son, then god is not pure : he displays human behavior & proving that he (just like any creature) has a race & genes. How would I respect my god, if he like humans, reproduce ?

In the ancient near east, the diplomatic relationships were described as "father-son" or "brother-brother". Allied kings that were equals would call each other brothers. A weaker king would call himself a son.

Each city was ruled by a god, and the king of that city would be considered the human caretaker of the god's city. The king would be like the son of that god.

A particularly devout person might also be called a "son of God".

I'm sure most people have heard all this before. So "son of God" isn't necessarily a shocking title for a prophet.

EDIT: I realized the title "son of God" wasn't the issue, but the idea of the virgin birth of particular son. So what I said above doesn't help.

(March 24, 2015 at 10:40 am)Drich Wrote: God the Father is still 'God.'
God the Son is still 'God'
God the Holy Spirit is still 'God.'

Remember the word God is a title it describes a Job or position. All three members have and hold their positions before durning and after Jesus' time on Earth.

So three beings basically. That's what Mormons believe.

(March 24, 2015 at 2:05 pm)Irrational Wrote:

(March 24, 2015 at 10:40 am)Drich Wrote: God the Father is still 'God.'
God the Son is still 'God'
God the Holy Spirit is still 'God.'

Remember the word God is a title it describes a Job or position. All three members have and hold their positions before durning and after Jesus' time on Earth.

So three beings basically. That's what Mormons believe.

Ah, no.

Mormons believe the Father had sex with a celestial mother and Jesus was the first born 'spirit' to populate this world. In essence Jesus is of the same stock we all are. Therefore not apart of a triune God.

Oh and the father was a man just like everyone else's at one point a long time ago on another earth like planet.

So again no not like the mormons.

(March 24, 2015 at 8:14 pm)Drich Wrote:

(March 24, 2015 at 2:05 pm)Irrational Wrote: So three beings basically. That's what Mormons believe.

Ah, no.

Mormons believe the Father had sex with a celestial mother and Jesus was the first born 'spirit' to populate this world. In essence Jesus is of the same stock we all are. Therefore not apart of a triune God.

Oh and the father was a man just like everyone else's at one point a long time ago on another earth like planet.

So again no not like the mormons.

Mormons believe that there are three beings in one "Godhead". How is your description of God different from theirs? Yours doesn't sound Trinitarian to me.

(March 23, 2015 at 9:34 am)Norman Humann Wrote: Atlas versus Drich. This is going to be a legendary shitstorm.

My money's on Atlas. Drippy is a shithead.

(March 25, 2015 at 2:24 am)Irrational Wrote:

(March 24, 2015 at 8:14 pm)Drich Wrote: Ah, no.

Mormons believe the Father had sex with a celestial mother and Jesus was the first born 'spirit' to populate this world. In essence Jesus is of the same stock we all are. Therefore not apart of a triune God.

Oh and the father was a man just like everyone else's at one point a long time ago on another earth like planet.

So again no not like the mormons.

Mormons believe that there are three beings in one "Godhead". How is your description of God different from theirs? Yours doesn't sound Trinitarian to me.

I believe those deity are indeed all God always have been God and always be God, that God has no beginning and no end. That there was nothing greater than God I also believe that God is a title and not a name. They believe that God is the name of the Father/exhuman who literally had a son with some goddess/mother type. Which redefines the word 'God' and the role christ would play as God. Because before the beginning that 'being' was once man, who was awarded God hood by some other deity/power.

Again just so you don't try and "Mormon"/twist what I said. I believe that the God head are titles of three different being who always were and ever will be God. There was none before nor will their ever be any other God.

That is how they are different. Again not simply beings, but eternal (past/present) deities.

---

(March 24, 2015 at 11:29 am)robvalue Wrote: It's the same God, he's just winding one/both of you up. It's still Morgan Freeman.

I hope not... I've told a lot of black jokes in my day.

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(March 24, 2015 at 11:27 am)JuliaL Wrote: Completely different religions???
No connection? Not the same god?

Pray tell, how is that?

It's a very simple precept.

This precept starts with the defination of the word religion. It is defined as specific patern of Faith and method of worship.

Meaning a religion is man's rights and rituals use to worship God/gods

In OT Judaism worship consists of a strict adhearence to what is identified as "The Law."

In NT Christianity worship is centered around freedom from Jewish practices of worship of said law.

Two complete opposite ways of worship= 2 different religions.

(March 26, 2015 at 12:47 pm)Drich Wrote:

(March 25, 2015 at 2:24 am)Irrational Wrote: Mormons believe that there are three beings in one "Godhead". How is your description of God different from theirs? Yours doesn't sound Trinitarian to me.

I believe that the God head are titles of three different being who always were and ever will be God. There was none before nor will their ever be any other God.

That is how they are different. Again not simply beings, but eternal (past/present) deities.

Three different beings? Ok, forget Mormonism if that offends you. But it certainly sounds like Tritheism which is not the same as Trinitarianism.

Tritheism: Three different beings with the title of God.
Trinitarianism: One God in three Persons.

Professor

(March 23, 2015 at 1:46 pm)professor Wrote: In your above post, what was omitted is the Justice of God.
Islam focuses on the mercy of God but forgets that He is perfectly just, therefore what Islam presents is false.

I disagree that our goodness would be rejected. What kind of god, rejects the goodness of his creations ? that's a claim, professor, is very insulting to god, since it shows error in his creation ; thus why create me if you know I'm useless ?

This Quranic verse might shed the light, on what I personally think a response :


( 56 ) And I did not create the jinn and mankind except to worship Me.
( 57 ) I do not want from them any provision, nor do I want them to feed Me.
( 58 ) Indeed, it is Allah who is the [continual] Provider, the firm possessor of strength.
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#a...rans=en_sh

My point of view is no, god created us knowing, that we would live only by worshiping him, eating & thanking him for the delicious taste, watching the cherry blossom then share a smile with the nature he created, by willingly providing your loved ones food & shelter, to some cases you might even get a pet, feeding it is also a worship to god ; we can do good, but it's all gotta take place, while believing he exists. Believing he is one, complete, doesn't play games with humans via wearing a human skin and waving to the crowds from a cross.

Above the 7 heavens, we would only catch a glimpse in judgement day ; weather we would see him or not.

If you excuse me, professor, I think the concept you provided is very insulting to the lord. I can't imagine myself worshiping a god wearing human skin & never accepts good deeds.

A Quranic verse :

( 25 ) And it is He who accepts repentance from his servants and pardons misdeeds, and He knows what you do.
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#a...rans=en_sh

( 25 ) ( 104 ) Do they not know that it is Allah who accepts repentance from His servants and receives charities and that it is Allah who is the Accepting of repentance, the Merciful?
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#a...rans=en_sh

And the most important :

[color=#1E90FF][b]( 54 ) And when those come to you who believe in Our verses, say, "Peace be upon you. Your Lord has decreed upon Himself mercy: that any of you who does wrong out of ignorance and then repents after that and corrects himself - indeed, He is Forgiving and Merciful."http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#aya=6_54&m=hafs&qaree=husary&trans=en_sh


God is perfectly just, that's why he must accept good, no matter how small it is. The condition though, is to believe in god himself, the one, the creator. I think christianity was forged right in this spot, to instead of copying what Jesus peace be upon him said literally, they opened a hole in the religion to make people live and sin as much as they can, then just because they believed in the lord they would be saved. Which negates a just god.

A just god, would judge from deeds and acts. With accurate scales, with infinite knowledge :

( 4 ) It is the Day when people will be like moths, dispersed,
( 5 ) And the mountains will be like wool, fluffed up.
( 6 ) Then as for one whose scales are heavy [with good deeds],
( 7 ) He will be in a pleasant life.
( 8 ) But as for one whose scales are light,
( 9 ) His refuge will be an abyss.
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#a...rans=en_sh

Very accurate scales :

( 47 ) And We place the scales of justice for the Day of Resurrection, so no soul will be treated unjustly at all. And if there is [even] the weight of a mustard seed, We will bring it forth. And sufficient are We as accountant.
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#a...rans=en_sh

I actually disagree with most of your comment, after reading it carefully now, but thank you and kudos for it's educational on Christian faith.

Quote:How interesting Atlas, that you quoted a bunch of your verses focused only on someone ELSE's evil.
While neglecting your own.
This is called "Self righteousness" and is a delusion. A lie.
A lie upon which ALL the religions of the world System (created by the devil) have as their foundation.
Satan is the father of lies.
It is high time to wake up from the stupor of drinking his lies.
A good prayer is:
God in Heaven- SHOW ME Your Truth......

Dude this is a discussion not a conversion war. You are what you are & I'm what I'm you can't change that. The Quran says about this situation :

(( 99 ) And had your Lord willed, those on earth would have believed - all of them entirely. Then, [O Muhammad], would you compel the people in order that they become believers?
( 100 ) And it is not for a soul to believe except by permission of Allah, and He will place defilement upon those who will not use reason.
( 101 ) Say, "Observe what is in the heavens and earth." But of no avail will be signs or warners to a people who do not believe
http://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#a...rans=en_sh

But could you too, live to the verse ? I mean it's good stuff, actually it's called "democracy".

I'll give you points on having a clearer view of what justice is that some christians, Atlas. What you do should be more important than what you say. Even most christians who believe works do play an important part will still say that worshiping Yahweh comes first. So you have Jeffrey Dahmer in heaven while Mahatma Ghandi is in hell.