Someone Explain This 'Shutdown' to Me?

[Anomalocaris]

Whether trump could have committed treason to a large degree depend on interpretation of the word “enemies”.   If the interpretation is broad, then trump can fry, or preferable end in a manner much much more prolonged and continuously unpleasant.

Actually, 'enemies' is legally defined (as regards treason), so there isn't a lot of room for interpretation.

But don't get me wrong - Trump is an absolutely vile, corrupt president, and few things would make me happier than to see him frog-marched out of office. But treason?  Nope, not yet.


Boru

I think the definition of enemies is not as clear cut as those who reasonable would wish the definition to be clear cut thinks.

The definition of enemies is generally taken to mean parties with whom the US is in ether a declared state of war, or in open war.

An declaration of war can certainly be retroactive, as some declarations of war in American history has been.   Notably American declaration of war against japan after Pearl Harbor was retroactive to the attack on Pearl Harbor itself.

So it is certainly possible for the US to declare today a state of has existed with Russia since the day before yesterday, thus what trump did yesterday to give aid and comfort to Russia was treason.

The question is what can be spun as a plausible causus belli the day before yesterday and thus the declaration of war itself can be made to seem legitimate.   This is all very banana-republicky,  but we are living in a banana republic now, and it does not seem nearly as improbable now as it did two years ago that the US will attain that level of banana-ness in the future.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Actually, 'enemies' is legally defined (as regards treason), so there isn't a lot of room for interpretation.

But don't get me wrong - Trump is an absolutely vile, corrupt president, and few things would make me happier than to see him frog-marched out of office. But treason?  Nope, not yet.


Boru

I think the definition of enemies is not as clear cut as those who reasonable would wish the definition to be clear cut thinks.

The definition of enemies is generally taken to mean parties with whom the US is in ether a declared state of war, or in open war.

An declaration of war can certainly be retroactive, as some declarations of war in American history has been.   Notably American declaration of war against japan after Pearl Harbor was retroactive to the attack on Pearl Harbor itself.

So it is certainly possible for the US to declare today a state of has existed with Russia since the day before yesterday, thus what trump did yesterday to give aid and comfort to Russia was treason.

The question is what can be spun as a plausible causus belli the day before yesterday and thus the declaration of war itself can be made to seem legitimate.   This is all very banana-republicky,  but we are living in a banana republic now, and it does not seem nearly as improbable now as it did two years ago that the US will attain that level of banana-ness in the future.

Some legal opinions hold that charging Trump with treason would be tantamount to a declaration of war, which strikes me as a good reason not to do it. But a better reason not to charge him with treason is that it would be a shaky prosecution at best, especially as there are so many, many other things to charge him with which stand a much better chance of holding up.

Boru

[tackattack]

That’s a bit of a hasty generalization about Jesus and Christians in general

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

That’s a bit of a hasty generalization about Jesus and Christians in general

Sorry, to which post are you referring?

Boru

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Shutdown is about Trump turning attention from crimes he committed by illegally collaborating with Russians. Let's face it Trump doesn't give a fuck about anything but himself and he'll do anything to preserve himself including shutting down the government and diverting attention from:
1) Trump asked the Russians to hack Clinton.
2) Don Jr. met with operatives promising dirt.
3) Manafort shared polling with possible Russian agent.
4) Phone records indicate Cohen visited Prague.
5) Flynn lied to the FBI.

He doesn't care for illegal immigrants since he also employs them himself and if he was concerned for safety of the people he would rather work on laws like that curb pollution or laws about gun safety since 40,000 people died in the US from guns last year.

Things you won't hear from Trump are:
DEA - bulk of drugs come across the Mexican border at legal ports of entry.
HSA - most new undocumented immigrants are visa overstays
Seven times more immigrants in terrorism database stopped crossing the Canadian border, than Mexican border

because it's not about border and safety but his own ass.

This is nonsense. It was understood when the American people elected him that the a wall would be established at some point on the southern border.  The same people opposing it now (Schumer, Pelosi, etc...) voted for a border wall some years back, but it didn't pass.  Pretty sure it was in 2004.   Schumer and Pelosi both have walls around their property.  Wonder why they would so such a thing.

Neither Schumer nor Pelosi have walls around their property.

Schumer lives here:

https://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/2017011...mer-house/

Pelosi lives here:

https://www.snopes.com/tachyon/2018/02/p...-house.jpg

Boru

[no one]

Sayer of nays:
Trump is a baby trapped in a fat adults body and currently, he's having a very expensive tantrum.

That about sums it up!

[tackattack]

That’s a bit of a hasty generalization about Jesus and Christians in general

Sorry, to which post are you referring?

Boru

---

Ok

Because democrats don't try to rig elections?

- Democrats pay retired British M16 agent, Richard Steele, GPS Fusion to generate a dossier on a Trump-Russia connection.  Steele, of course, ran the Russia desk out of M16 in London until he retried.
- DNC sabotages Hillary Clinton rival Bernie Sanders and forces him out of their primary.  Over 20,000 e-mails were hacked by Wikileaks and made public, including e-mails from DNC officials discussing using the media to derail the Sander's campaign.
- Broward County election supervisor, Brenda Snipes, "misplaced" more than 2000 ballots during Florida 2018 general election.  Why she was even in charge of Broward County in 2018 is disturbing after the mess from 2016 when the same person had a ruling against her for violating the Florida Constitution and illegally destroying ballots.

The christ nutter deflecting for that orange haired greedy lecherous old buffoon.   How surprising.

The more one observed Christ nutters rallying around trump, the more clear one could see what a disgusting and reprehensible personage any original Jesus of Nazareth that ever existed could well have been.

---

bolding by me.


I digress... I'm just jumping out of the way of this thread, political thread move too fast for me to keep up and don't hold my interest long enough. Disregard.

[Rev. Rye]

Neither Schumer nor Pelosi have walls around their property.

Schumer lives here:

https://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/2017011...mer-house/

Pelosi lives here:

https://www.snopes.com/tachyon/2018/02/p...-house.jpg

Boru

Yeah, it's kind of hard to build walls around your house when it's actually an apartment.

A better view of Pelosi's home from Google Street View.

And cross-referenced against an old photo of a protest at her home:


I suppose there are some views where it looks like there might be some huge wall, but that's mostly because, well, you do know that a lot of the streets in San Francisco slope, right? And that that's how they rectify that? Hell, I chose a view that emphasises how open it really is.

[Fake Messiah]

Even Trump himself doesn't believe walls can stop people

[T0 Th3 M4X]

Neither Schumer nor Pelosi have walls around their property.

Schumer lives here:

https://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/2017011...mer-house/

Pelosi lives here:

https://www.snopes.com/tachyon/2018/02/p...-house.jpg

Boru

Yeah, it's kind of hard to build walls around your house when it's actually an apartment.

A better view of Pelosi's home from Google Street View.

And cross-referenced against an old photo of a protest at her home:


I suppose there are some views where it looks like there might be some huge wall, but that's mostly because, well, you do know that a lot of the streets in San Francisco slope, right? And that that's how they rectify that? Hell, I chose a view that emphasises how open it really is.

Pelosi owns at least four homes.  So pick the one without a wall?

It sad though, because it looks like a lot of the photos got scrubbed off the Internet, and all that's left are the older photos of her red brick manse.  Of course, I can't prove it, so I'll leave it alone.

She owns at least one home in Georgetown.  Plus a vineyard in California.

The controversy is over the Queen Anne home, which isn't her home, but in the general location of the red brick manse, so no disagreement there.