Abortion: 10 years as an atheist and I still don't get it

[Agnostico]

So you're saying the propaganda videos had the desired effect of manipulating your emotions?

U call facts propaganda which in itself says a lot
And u criticize me on having empathy for an innocent human life

Another fine example of atheist morality, or lack of it

[The Grand Nudger]

The case for reproductive rights doesn't lie in any disagreement between facts and propaganda, or on any item of faith. Lay that aside. Assume that everything in your video is true, but understand that this still happens when we ban abortion.

If harm coming to a fetus because of a law is a tragedy, then harm coming to a fetus and it's mother can only be more so. Agreed?

[Nay_Sayer]

Name one, citing relevant legislation.

You know your argument would go better if it had anything truthful you could base it on.  But then again as your linked videos amply demonstrate, anti-abortionists wouldn't know the truth if it bit them on their arses.

This article is less than a year old. It has a table showing which american states have bans on partial birth abortion.
20 states prohibit partial birth abortion

https://www.kff.org/womens-health-policy...2asc%22%7D

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I was replying to your satatement "To me killing an unborn child is the same as killing a born child."

These are very very different things.

Fair enough I see your point.
Killing a 3 month old child is also different to killing a 6 month old child too

I guess what I meant is that killing an unborn child is effectively ending a human life

The question becomes when does a human life begin? Is it at birth, at conception, when a heartbeat can be heard or another stage of the pregnancy. 
I don't know. I just know that learning about abortions and watching them makes me feel like it's wrong

 
Again, I'm sorry, but it isn't.

[Mister Agenda]

A human life never begins. At no point is there something that is not human and not alive that 'becomes a life'. It makes just as much sense to make sure no eggs go unfertilized for the sake of their potential humanity as it does to require the same of a brainless zygote.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

arewethereyet and I are both big fans of a BBC programme, 'Call The Midwife'.  It concerns a group of nurse/midwives in the East End of London in the late 50s through the mid 60s and is based on the memoirs of one of the midwives.

Several episodes of the series deal with the consequences of illegal abortions - the effects of quacks medicines intended to induce miscarriages, the use by back-alley practitioners of unsterilized instruments, the failed attempts that result in horribly crippled but still living infants, and so on.  It is absolutely harrowing, and is a pretty reliable mirror of what happens in the real world when abortion is outlawed.

Law or no law, abortions will still take place just as they always have.  You don't like abortion? Fine, there's nothing that says you have to approve of the practice.  But attempts to outlaw or restrict the practice are cruelty of a stunning magnitude.  It is the condemning of women - often frightened, frequently poor - to seek out butchers instead of doctors.  It is putting at risk the health and safety of pregnant women, regardless of economic or social status.  It is the removal of the right of bodily autonomy. It is telling half of all human beings that they are second class citizens.

Shame on anyone who votes for, lobbies for, legislates for, or even supports the criminalization of abortion.  Shame, shame, shame.

Boru

[Mister Agenda]

It's a potential human life.

Until viability it's a cluster of cells.

The vast majority of abortions occur before viability and very few are carried out in the last trimesta.

Fair enough. I don't agree that it's just a cluster of cells before viability but I see what your saying

A good argument can be made for making viability the cut off point of abortion

Except for all of the complications that can follow that cut off point. Do you know that for many of those third semester abortions the fetus is already dead and the alternative to removing it from the woman's womb is to let it rot and fester inside of her? Or that many of those third semester abortions are performed because a complication of pregnancy has occurred that puts the mother's life at risk if she delivers?

You'd think people who are truly against abortions would choose the policies most likely to reduce the number of abortions. Banning them has never accomplished that. Canada has no laws at all restricting abortions but comprehensive sex education and readily available birth control and the number of abortions performed per capita are a fraction of the rate in the USA. But those people are not really against abortions, they're against women being able to manage their own medical decisions if they've dared to risk pregnancy.

[The Grand Nudger]

It's also telling medical professionals that their attempts to reduce or sidestep the cruelty of a ban are criminal. Doctors still perform abortions when abortion is banned.

It's difficult to comprehend how a person can look at something and think "this is horrible, somebody should do something about this"...then, after mulling it over and consulting their conscience, decide that the thing to do is make it even more horrible.

[Mr Greene]

So you're saying the propaganda videos had the desired effect of manipulating your emotions?

U call facts propaganda which in itself says a lot
And u criticize me on having empathy for an innocent human life

Another fine example of atheist morality, or lack of it

The fact is that the procedure you describe is not usual and cannot reasonably be described as in any way typical.
It was chosen specifically for it's emotional effect which you clearly experienced but haven't grasped the manipulation and distortion of facts involved.
If you cared about the truth you might try finding out what a typical procedure actually involves.

[Agnostico]

This is just another one of those topics that the secular community support for one reason only... To oppose religion
If they wanted to make it legal to kill a baby up to 6 months, these guys would support it

All this concern about the health of the woman isn't genuine. If it was then the mental health of the woman would be taken into consideration.
Most women are left mentally scared by abortion. 
Guilt
anxiety
depression
eating disorders
alcohol and drug abuse
fear of infertility, suicidal thoughts
post traumatic stress disorder
post abortion stress syndrome
avoiding kids or pregnant women
unable to bond with present or future children
fear that her children will die

No one is concerned for the woman health post abortion

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

This is just another one of those topics that the secular community support for one reason only... To oppose religion
If they wanted to make it legal to kill a baby up to 6 months, these guys would support it

All this concern about the health of the woman isn't genuine. If it was then the mental health of the woman would be taken into consideration.
Most women are left mentally scared by abortion. 
Guilt
anxiety
depression
eating disorders
alcohol and drug abuse
fear of infertility, suicidal thoughts
post traumatic stress disorder
post abortion stress syndrome
avoiding kids or pregnant women
unable to bond with present or future children
fear that her children will die

No one is concerned for the woman health post abortion

Well, we could force a woman to carry the child of her rapist for nine months.  I'm sure that wouldn't cause ANY psychological stress.

And for the record, I don't support abortion rights as a way  to oppose religion.  I support abortion rights as a way to promote human dignity.  I would be beyond delighted if no woman ever found herself in a position where she would consider abortion, where every child was wanted, loved and cared for. So before you ascribe motives to me which I do not possess, you can kindly fuck directly off.

Boru