Why I am so passionate about speaking out against feminism.

[One Above All]

Because I already knew that she was a radical feminist, I knew that she was a tumblr feminist. And she was always talking about how lots of men are rapists and that women get abused so much. Feminism was a very big thing for her. And I don't know of any other group that so readily dismisses women abusing men yet whilst making such a fuss about men abusing women, without recognising the double standard. Some of things she did to me (whilst totally harmless), if I did those things to her, I would have definitely been arrested, simply because it was a man doing it to a woman. This is something she didn't seem to realise because she accused me of assault.

Have you considered that she's just... you know, unstable? Maybe bipolar or something akin to it?

[Bad Wolf]

I guess it comes down to what you define Feminism as. I've always thought of it as equality for women. In your example it would mean that the accusations are handled in exactly the same way, regardless of the sex/race/religion/societal status of either party.

I don't exactly know how to define feminism. They say equality but by what standard? Do they mean equality in that they are treated like men? Or are they striving for their own standard of equality?

Do you believe in equal rights for women and men? (I imagine you do)

Of course.

Do you think that Feminism is different to this, and if so how/why?

I think feminism is inherently flawed, the name itself gives to gender bias. I think the whole equality movement is good but we are going about it the wrong way. We can't have feminism and whatever the mens rights movement is called, that just breeds conflict and it will never get resolved. what we need is one unifying banner and organisation, something like 'equalists' or 'egalitarians'

---

Have you considered that she's just... you know, unstable? Maybe bipolar or something akin to it?

I think its a bit of both. I think she turned to such radical views of feminism because she was unstable. I blame her reaction on her mental condition and her radical feminism for preventing her from seeing the double standards. The ironic thing is, all feminists want is equality with men and I treated Jane pretty much as I would treat any guy, and yet she apparently she didn't like it.

[Little lunch]

I'm sorry for that stuff I said the other day and I'm sorry you had to go through all that with your friend.

I'm pro-feminist because, although I didn't realise it, I have been a sexist pig for a lot of my life.
Becoming an atheist made me sceptical of everything and in turn made me look more at myself. Having a daughter made me look at other men's actions also.
Just like the matrix, I took the blue pill and it turned my world upside down.
It's been a hard, long road, slowly changing my whole belief system that I was indoctrinated with at birth. Feminism and atheism.
I still make many mistakes.
I mistook you for being someone like me, so again I'm sorry. :-)

[FreeTony]

BadWolf - I agree with a lot you say actually, especially the part about not separating into two factions battling one another. This does no one any good.

However, you did entitle the thread "why I am so passionate about speaking out against feminism", then go on to say that "I don't exactly know how to define feminism". If you're going to criticise something, you need a very clear idea of what it is that you are criticising.

You are most likely speaking out against what you perceive to be Feminism, rather than the reality. In some cases the two may coincide, like in your incident, however I think mostly this isn't the case.

[Bad Wolf]

The thread was supposed to explain why I often talk about and criticize feminism, it didn't necessarily imply that my criticisms were right. It was just meant as an explanation as to why I'm against feminism when sometimes I shouldn't be.

[Brakeman]

I can appreciate the difference.

I think there are two types of feminism, one that fights for women's social equality, and one that uses society's newfound aversion to misogyny as a weapon. As a father of 3 daughters, I strongly believe in equality. When my wife asks me to do a "man's" job, killing a spider or something like that, I often ask her if the job really requires a penis because I've never killed a spider with my penis.

I have been falsely accused though. It's still quite the sore spot. In high school some girl or girls started the rumor that I had raped a mystery girl and that my father had paid the girl to be quiet about it. Nothing could have been further from the truth as at the time of the rumor I was still a virgin and my father, as a baptist preacher, would have rather organized a stoning than protecting me from that.
I discovered the rumor when a girl I had asked on a date suddenly canceled our first date citing the story. I vehemently denied it and even though I begged for details, she wouldn't say where she heard it from. A year later a girl I had been dating suddenly couldn't go out with me anymore because the rumor had resurfaced and had somehow gotten to her father. Again, no one would ever give any details or allow me to defend myself. The latter one really pissed me off. I still ask her to come clean thirty years latter and she won't reply. Bitch!

[Bad Wolf]

When my wife asks me to do a "man's" job, killing a spider or something like that, I often ask her if the job really requires a penis because I've never killed a spider with my penis.

Oh tell me about it! I live with 5 women and every time, EVERY FUCKING TIME, screaming, squealing and calling out for me to squash it when they could do it just as easily. I get it, you don't like spiders, neither do I. We don't even get any dangerous ones here in Cambridge apart from the False Widow.

I have been falsely accused though. It's still quite the sore spot. In high school some girl or girls started the rumor that I had raped a mystery girl and that my father had paid the girl to be quiet about it. Nothing could have been further from the truth as at the time of the rumor I was still a virgin and my father, as a baptist preacher, would have rather organized a stoning than protecting me from that.
I discovered the rumor when a girl I had asked on a date suddenly canceled our first date citing the story. I vehemently denied it and even though I begged for details, she wouldn't say where she heard it from. A year later a girl I had been dating suddenly couldn't go out with me anymore because the rumor had resurfaced and had somehow gotten to her father. Again, no one would ever give any details or allow me to defend myself. The latter one really pissed me off. I still ask her to come clean thirty years latter and she won't reply. Bitch!

Jeesh! That all sucks. At least no body I know so far believes the stuff that was said about me.

[bladevalant546]

Thanks for sharing, I can understand why you have a bias against feminism and why you such aversion to it. It is a natural response to the stimuli of your environment. Much like my phobia of wasps was stimulated by myself back when I was 8 being stung by an entire nest of them. It was a traumatic event that seeded my irrational or in your case bias outlook.

Now I think most of your objections and obvious double standards are correct and I have observed said "misandry" myself. And you do acknowledge that it is only the radical feminists that are products of your issues and you are attempting to not equate them with the other good feminists. Now I saw a response talking about trying to marginalize her actions to being bipolar (I think she is showing traits of borderline personality disorder not bipolar). The thing is she was using feminism as her justification of her psychological actions. Regardless her brains actions, the justifications are the radical feminist ideologies. Not address her ideals first are exactly why she will never confront her possible issues with her father and get real treatment of her condition. So yea in part the radical feminism is to blame for some of her actions. Like most things is not just that.

I think for one equalists or egalitarian movements should be the future. Mainly because well movements need to evolve. I however bad wolf would watch Miss Representation, is a good documentary that really goes into the real feminism, and touches based on radicals and even addresses self impose sexism by us males upon ourselves. The point is the healing process one should take is understanding of the other side and overcoming the emotion hurt that creates this bias, or at least rationalizing it. I believe you have a legitimate hurt and honestly to you a very real correlation. Despite what others might say, I think being honest with the fact you might not have a full view as honest. Next step is to understand. So again watch that documentary it really allowed me to see feminism as the real movement was.

[*Deidre*]

There are a number of definitions out there for the term "feminism." But feminism, at its purest base and the intent of its origination, was to bring about equality for all persons, regardless of gender. Over the years, there have been outliers who have hijacked it for their own grievances and agendas. I consider myself a feminist but I'm interested in equal civil rights for all people. I'm not a fan of the phrase "rape culture," and do think that men can get a raw deal in many areas of society. There is unfortunately a disconnect amongst feminists when it comes to agreement but that's in any group.

Not all Christians are sexist bigots but many are, for example. I don't necessarily solely blame the religion, as much as there are a number of factors as to why people behave as they do, good or bad.

Feminism has done far more good for women and society as a whole, than it hasn't.
We will always see bad apples though. The trick is to not broad brush an entire movement based on those bad apples.

Just my thoughts for now.

[bladevalant546]

I agree with that assessment Deidre, I think feminism needs to evolve into egalitarianism. For we have seen now, we all have a common enemy now. I think he is trying to narrow that brush, emotional trauma like that really can jack up ones world views.