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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 16, 2014 at 10:14 am
He realised he couldn't actually defend his position a while ago.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am
I'll answer a few questions.
(May 2, 2014 at 1:19 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: 1) How did all the animals fit on the ark? Noah only collected the animals he was instructed to - he didn't go collecting animals transcontinental.
Quote:3) Even if we accept the nonsense that two of every species of animal fitted on the ark. What did they eat and drink for 40 days? Are you telling me that there was 40 days worth of food on the ark for each animal. Bearing in mind that the different species need different food sources. For example, pandas eat exclusively bamboo. Koalas eat eucalyptus leaves. What, did they grow the plants on board? Where was the room for that? And how did they store all the water for the animals? How much water did they need? Can someone calculate that?
Well it was an ark, over dry land that was flooded with (fresh) rainwater, so I'd say they didn't need to store any water.
Quote:7) A wooden ship the size of the ark would have had leaks. How did so few amount of people prevent the ark from sinking?
It wasn't a ship, it was an ark.
Quote:11) If only two of every species survived there would be evidence of a genetic bottle neck. But there isn't.
Humans have had at least two identified bottlenecks.
For Religion & Health see:[/b][/size] Williams & Sternthal. (2007). Spirituality, religion and health: Evidence and research directions. Med. J. Aust., 186(10), S47-S50. -LINK
The WIN/Gallup End of Year Survey 2013 found the US was perceived to be the greatest threat to world peace by a huge margin, with 24% of respondents fearful of the US followed by: 8% for Pakistan, and 6% for China. This was followed by 5% each for: Afghanistan, Iran, Israel, North Korea. -LINK
"That's disgusting. There were clean athletes out there that have had their whole careers ruined by people like Lance Armstrong who just bended thoughts to fit their circumstances. He didn't look up cheating because he wanted to stop, he wanted to justify what he was doing and to keep that continuing on." - Nicole Cooke
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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 16, 2014 at 10:58 am
(May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am)Aractus Wrote: Noah only collected the animals he was instructed to - he didn't go collecting animals transcontinental.
So how did all the other animals survive? Was this just a regional flood?
Quote:Well it was an ark, over dry land that was flooded with (fresh) rainwater, so I'd say they didn't need to store any water.
And the food? 
Quote:It wasn't a ship, it was an ark.
I know you're not dumb enough to think this answers the question that was being asked.
Quote:Humans have had at least two identified bottlenecks.
Neither of which indicate a reduction of the population to just eight people.
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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 16, 2014 at 11:02 am
(This post was last modified: May 16, 2014 at 11:19 am by Bad Wolf.)
(May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am)Aractus Wrote: Noah only collected the animals he was instructed to - he didn't go collecting animals transcontinental.
That didn't actually answer the question of how 2 of every terrestrial, avian and semi-aquatic species fitted onto the ark.
(May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am)Aractus Wrote: Well it was an ark, over dry land that was flooded with (fresh) rainwater, so I'd say they didn't need to store any water.
Even if that was scientifically accurate (which I don't know that it is) you conveniently missed the part about the food.
(May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am)Aractus Wrote: It wasn't a ship, it was an ark.
Is there any meaningful distinction?
(May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am)Aractus Wrote: Humans have had at least two identified bottlenecks.
And did one of these bottlenecks occur when the supposed flood happened? And even if it did, that means nothing as you would see a bottleneck in every species not just our own.
And what about the rest of my questions? Couldn't answer them?
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 16, 2014 at 10:23 pm
(May 16, 2014 at 11:02 am)Bad Wolf Wrote: (May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am)Aractus Wrote: It wasn't a ship, it was an ark. Is there any meaningful distinction? Of course there is, a ship is designed to travel places. An ark is simply designed to float.
Quote:That didn't actually answer the question of how 2 of every terrestrial, avian and semi-aquatic species fitted onto the ark.
He only collected animals from the region where he lived (modern day Turkey).
Quote: (May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am)Aractus Wrote: Well it was an ark, over dry land that was flooded with (fresh) rainwater, so I'd say they didn't need to store any water.
Even if that was scientifically accurate (which I don't know that it is) you conveniently missed the part about the food. Well how many species of animal are in Turkey? I'm sure they're not all as fussy eaters as Koalas (if you find an injured Koala and put it into captivity, you have to go out and collect leaves from a dozen or so different Eucalyptus trees to find out which tree it will eat from).
Quote: (May 16, 2014 at 10:46 am)Aractus Wrote: Humans have had at least two identified bottlenecks.
And did one of these bottlenecks occur when the supposed flood happened? And even if it did, that means nothing as you would see a bottleneck in every species not just our own. A second ago you said there were no genetic bottlenecks. We don't know if the flood happened 10,000 years ago, 50,000 years ago or 200,000 years ago so it's a moot point.
Noah built an ark, the region got flooded, the ark floated for 40 days, and when the waters started to run back into the rivers/ocean the ark came to rest on one of the mountains along the Armenian Highlands. There are at least 2 or 3 different areas (natural basins) where this could have happened, and at least one place that has been shown to have flooded to the extent necessary (ie no more visible land from your ark).
For Religion & Health see:[/b][/size] Williams & Sternthal. (2007). Spirituality, religion and health: Evidence and research directions. Med. J. Aust., 186(10), S47-S50. -LINK
The WIN/Gallup End of Year Survey 2013 found the US was perceived to be the greatest threat to world peace by a huge margin, with 24% of respondents fearful of the US followed by: 8% for Pakistan, and 6% for China. This was followed by 5% each for: Afghanistan, Iran, Israel, North Korea. -LINK
"That's disgusting. There were clean athletes out there that have had their whole careers ruined by people like Lance Armstrong who just bended thoughts to fit their circumstances. He didn't look up cheating because he wanted to stop, he wanted to justify what he was doing and to keep that continuing on." - Nicole Cooke
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The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 16, 2014 at 10:30 pm
(This post was last modified: May 16, 2014 at 11:00 pm by Rampant.A.I..)
...So did the Koalas get raptured and de-raptured, or...
Also, according to the bible, it rained for 40 days and 40 nights.
Genesis 7:11
On the seventeenth day of the second month of the six hundredth year of Noah's life, all the deep springs burst open.
Genesis 8:13
By the first day of the first month of Noah's six hundred and first year, the water on the land had dried up. Noah opened the top of the ship, looked out, and saw the surface of the ground.
And Turkey has about 25,000 species of identified fauna. That would place, at minimum, 50,000 animals on the Ark FOR A YEAR.
http://iucn.org/about/union/secretariat/...-in-Turkey
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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 16, 2014 at 10:34 pm
Can we title this story Danny's Ark since you just pulled it out of your ass?
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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 17, 2014 at 6:47 am
(May 16, 2014 at 10:23 pm)Aractus Wrote: Of course there is, a ship is designed to travel places. An ark is simply designed to float.
And would this difference in function affect whether it leaked or not? You still didn't answer my question. There were something like 8 people on the ark right? How did 8 people plug the leaks, bail out the water and prevent the ark from sinking?
(May 16, 2014 at 10:23 pm)Aractus Wrote: He only collected animals from the region where he lived (modern day Turkey).
Oh right! So you don't believe the bible when it says a world-wide flood? We're talking about different things here.
(May 16, 2014 at 10:23 pm)Aractus Wrote: Well how many species of animal are in Turkey? I'm sure they're not all as fussy eaters as Koalas (if you find an injured Koala and put it into captivity, you have to go out and collect leaves from a dozen or so different Eucalyptus trees to find out which tree it will eat from).
Dude....I thought I made it clear in the OP that I was arguing against a global flood, against the literal Noahs ark story. Why engage with me when you know your position is drastically different.
(May 16, 2014 at 10:23 pm)Aractus Wrote: A second ago you said there were no genetic bottlenecks.
No I didn't.
(May 16, 2014 at 10:23 pm)Aractus Wrote: We don't know if the flood happened 10,000 years ago, 50,000 years ago or 200,000 years ago so it's a moot point.
The bible says the flood was....what 6000 years ago, I don't know. And you don't believe the bible? Me neither. Also there is no evidence of a flood. And it is not a moot point. You argued that there were genetic bottlenecks in humans that correlate with the flood. We know when there was a bottleneck and there is no evidence of a flood back then.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 18, 2014 at 4:13 pm
Gosh, these ''arguments'' are as meaningless and pointless as arguing as to the possible size shoe that the 'old woman' lived in, according to Mother Goose. (that's also a made up story, in case anyone was still wondering)
Noah's Ark ...the story...is a fable. Not to be taken literally. To see religious people here debating as to what type of vessel it was, and what animals were taken, is nothing short of hilarious, but in a cringe-worthy way.
And these same folks dispute the validity of the the theory of evolution, that has evidence to support it.
Religion shuts down critical thinking. This thread is a good illustration of that.
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RE: The Noahs ark and why it didn't happen
May 18, 2014 at 4:36 pm
I don't know how any sane person can believe this arc stuff. All of these animals are just going to chill out together in peace? They would slaughter each other! It would be friggin blood bath! How did the old dude get the dinosaurs on this arc anyhow? Pretend they don't exist, fine, but how did he pursuade lions, tigers and bears to come along? There is just no way. Even great fantasy novels have to keep a touch of reality in order to keep their audience. This is just beyond silly.
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